Saturday, July 14, 2012

Sidetalking sociopath

The thing I like most about the existence of Dexter as a television show is that it is so widely-liked. This makes talking about sociopath issues without outing yourself very easy. I understand that some sociopaths are incognito, even amongst their friends and family. I myself am pretty out, and am always looking for others to bring into my inner-circle, which is why I am so happy about Dexter. It makes the perfect feel-someone-out-about-how-they-would-feel-knowing-that-their-friend/significant-other/family-member-is-a-sociopath conversation starter. After someone has told you they like it, you can query relatively harmlessly why they do. They may say that they love Dexter the character, or have respect for him, and you can follow up with what exactly it is about Dexter that makes him so likeable. Obviously he does bad things and at the very least has bad tendencies that he has to deal with. Does the way he deals with those tendencies somehow make up for his deficiencies? You can ask if they think he is an accurate portrayal of everyday sociopaths. Does this person believe that sociopaths like Dexter live in real life? Why or why not? If they are doing well so far, maybe ask, do they think that they have ever met a sociopath and not known that the person was a sociopath? If they start getting suspicious, back off. If they start asking you why you like Dexter, say, "Oh, just the same reasons you said." There is a lot of information to be gleaned by sidetalking about sociopathy this way. I'm trying to think of what would be a good analogy in a non-sociopath realm... being in the mafia and talking to people about the Sopranos? Being a spy and talking about Burn Notice? Being gay and talking about Queer as Folk? Being an ex-African warlord and talking about Hotel Rwanda?

193 comments:

  1. It's like being a Cylon in the new Battlestar Galactica. Some of us know what we are, some don't.

    Yea, I'm a nerd. Wanna fight about it?

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  2. I think its funny that there is a 'sociopathblog' for the simple reason that before shows like Dexter and House, the main public view of a sociopath, or even a psychopath for that matter, is that we're all criminals. Killers, Rapists, and everywhere in between that kind of crime and stealing a fucking bike.

    The truth is, that a lot of "anti-social" people are like House, in the sense that because we see things differently, we can gather a bit more insight into something. I plan to be a psychologist, because one of the most common pluses to being a sociopath is our ability to read through the lines in things like emotions: the way people say things, the words they use to describe them, even the tone that its said...I've found that a good number of us have that gift, so its only fair that the media shows that we're not all a bunch of evil, cold creatures out of a Thomas Harris novel.

    The fact is...there are more of us then the public thinks. And many of us do more good then bad. Hell, some of us even do more 'moral' things then your typical normal person.

    I mean, sure I've lied and played people, but it was for their own good! Hell, if I hadn't done it one time, a friend of mine would have blown his brains out in front of me, but I just did my thing and he's....well he's in jail for murder, but, hey at aleast he's alive....I had good reason to lie and trick him, I didn't know that he'd do that, just because I'm a sociopath doesn't mean I knew he was going to kill someone and thought something cartoonishly evil, like most people think someone like would...that isn't what we do. Normally, we are good people, normally....lol

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  3. Anonymous--you don't sound like a sociopath. You seem to have need to justify 'immoral' actions and your post implies you have some sense of right and wrong. Sociopaths are ''by definition'' 'evil' and cold; if they act otherwise, it is purely for ulterior reasons.

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    1. I don't think you have it quite right. Sociopaths know right from wrong...but they don't care that much. It's not about not caring at all...there is some care going on, but generally speaking it isn't enough reason on its own to sway things.

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  4. I never said that I wasn't "evil" by nature and I wasn't justifying anything. To justify something at all would mean that there was a need to defend, which I don’t think there is any reason to ever explain your actions, immoral or otherwise. And there is no evidence to prove what's right and wrong, since that is something that changes from person to person, and views of what is socially and morally right change depending on where you are in the world, and that goes for the mind too.

    And to say I don't sound like a sociopath is funny considering that you read my comment and from a mere 307 words, you think you have me pegged, that's so intuitive of you, lol. Saying I don’t sound like a sociopath from reading my comment is like saying I don’t look like a duck based on a written description from a person who heard another person’s description but forgot key elements in the details….if I don’t sound like a sociopath based on what I wrote, then I’ve chosen my words perfectly, so I sound like something I’m not….which is something this sociopath might do.

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  5. Late comment, sorry, but I just found this and I think it's interesting. I am not a sociopath, but Dexter has given me a higher opinion of sociopaths than I once had. I do respect him because I am able to understand how he thinks, and he is logical and reasonable as a character. However I think they made sure to make him a "safe" sociopath. His code is an artificial conscience, and I think it gives people watching the show the illusion that he has at least something of a real conscience. Also, he keeps saying he has no feelings, but occasionally he does exhibit what I would call feelings. I don't know any sociopaths that I'm aware of IRL, so I can't tell if this is accurate.

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  6. Before I knew I was a sociopath (and before I knew what a sociopath really was - "you mean we're not all serial killers?"), I thought Dexter was a flawed example of a sociopath. There were too many times throughout the show (and books) where he displayed real emotion.

    Now that I know I am a sociopath, I feel his character is much more accurate. It's not that I never feel emotion, it's just rare and usually pretty short-lived. I also can completely relate to the feeling of "almost" loving someone ("If I knew how to love, I would love Deb"). It's a sort of synthetic, rational love. It's how I feel about the people closest to me. I don't feel ways about things, but if I could, I'd feel ways about them.

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    1. (Cont...)

      Oh, and Dexter's code is definitely there to make people more comfortable with having a serial killer as a protagonist.

      Because, you know, he'd never hurt them. They're good people. Dexter doesn't hurt good people.

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  7. general butt naked presenting for duty

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    1. the last berzeker
      http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1333465/Liberias-General-Butt-Naked-The-evil-man-world.html

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  8. To repeat myself. A true socio/psychopathic mind cannot reveal oneself. Unless you have decided to go against your own nature and live up to some moral standards. But most psychopaths won’t do that. Maybe at a certain age one will become calmer because always watching your back can be tiring, also for a psychopath.

    Your knowledge about psychopathy is mostly theoretical M.E. The more I read your posts, the more I’m convinced that you have no clue how evil a true psychopathic mind is. Combine that with self-awareness of the condition and the knife will even be sharper. I can be the most charming and decent person you can imagine, but behind all these masks lives a creature that is aware that his superiority doesn’t come from his better than average intellect, but from his lack of empathy, guilt, shame … and in the end the lack of morals.

    Living the life and not just assuming to be a sociopath you leave behind ruins, emotional and financial ruins. At the end of the day there’s not one friend, not one family member you can tell about how you treat people and how it arouses you, people would simply be disgusted and immediately turn their back to you.

    At the end of the day as a psychopath you’re alone, but because of not caring and being amoral, you realize that you’re a lion among sheep. You go to bed realizing that you’re extremely lonely, but pleased with the fact that nature has made you the way you are, because looking towards the world with amoral eyes has given you more power and satisfaction than most kings ever had in their life.

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    1. reminds me of a conversation with my father we bouth know but we do not speak the words

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  9. Ortho; Greatly enjoyed your post. But, even given the volumes contained throughout this site, I am not so sure it's fair to suggest ME doesn't understand the depth of just how dark it can get. I would think this whole thing to be just another technique and game to fulfill the narcissistic side of ME anyway. Given that, I have found some rather insightful posts along the way. Yours being one.

    See, I have been playing a game and didn't even know I was playing it for something like 35 years now. Situations recently in my life have forced me to take a much more honest assessment of myself; who I was, who I had become, and how had all this happened. Part of the situation was with my wife of nearly 20 years, it's at the point I don't think our marriage can get any lower and the only reason we stick around is for the financial stability of the kids (the financial stability of me).

    I have kept myself, mind you, busy throughout the years. I am ending a 20 year career with the military; infantry. I have been allowed to go all over the world. My actual job description has very with each new duty station every 3 to 4 years, but here in the last ten years I have been allowed to go kill people from time to time and I do believe that thrill has passed. I has let me know I have no problems getting very deep in the dark side of the pool. Unlike many of my friends as we now grow older, I don't have bad dreams.

    Now, over the years I have heard the words psychopath and sociopath thrown around and through intuitive response the words provoked came to the conclusion the two words meant crazy in some twisted way. I also have know the word Casbah since The Clash rocked it and I had deduced that it had to be some sort of structure deriving it's roots from British involvement in the Middle East. I think I was closer to the truth with the word Casbah.

    If you have bared with me this long; as i see the end of a career and a very possible end to a marriage at the same time I come to light with the very real possibility I do have anti social personality issues that look very much like the description of a sociopath, I decide to lay the facts before my wife. Of course she jumped all over it. You see, she knows about 80% of the shit I've done. And she has seen me lay waste with no regard for how it may effect others with the exception of it possibly getting me caught.

    Strange thing; she didn't go running for the door (even after reading all the "Run As Fast As You Can From The Psycho In Your Life" blogs). She understands to try and oust me would not only be the end of our marriage, hence the end of the kid's financial stability, but it would also be futile. She tried to confront a issue I had years ago by telling the rest of my family. The rest of the family no longer really talk to my wife because I convinced them she was crazy. Get the picture.

    Other than the situation I just gave, I can't think of why I would want anyone else to know.

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  10. How To Heal a PDJuly 14, 2012 at 4:22 AM

    One of the description in many of the PD's is black and white thinking. This does not relate to intelligence, of course. It is an emotional kind of retarding. In the PDs I have seen, the emotions are those of a young child, in terms of discernment of the subtleties of themselves, as well as those of others. To make this practical, I will give an example. The person with the PD will see people as good or bad, nice or not nice. They will not see that in every "good" person is a "bad" part. In every "nice" person, there is a cruel part.
    Perhaps, one starts to have this discernment as a pre teen. If one grew up with a PD parent, one not be allowed to see the world in other than a black and white way.
    Hence, one would think he was wrong, as in the movie "King of Hearts" where the whole world was insane, except him. Hence, he was deemed insane.

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    1. How To Heal a PDJuly 14, 2012 at 4:51 AM

      When you have someone in your life with a PD, you hate them. You want to make them pay, but can they? Is it like asking a retarded person to do advanced math? Can they ever know how to see things differently? Can they mimic, at best?

      If so, what do you do?
      Have very, very strong boundaries, as if with a recalcitrant child.

      Is that the best for which one can hope?

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    2. with a shotgun ofc

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    3. Will a claw hammer do?

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    4. Anon 4:04
      What honesty, thanks! But your wife has "little" respect for herself to allow you to get away with that "crazy" shit.

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    5. Wow, you're such a bitch. When you have someone with a problem in your life you want retribution for who they are. That's pretty holier than thou for the angle your trying to sell with the I never bite first angle.

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    6. Just worry about yourself, Nasty.

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    7. Now I'm nasty. You're the one discarding people because they're different. And justifying ill treatment of anyone with different perspective.

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    8. Nasty
      You can talk in fucking circles. I will give that one to you.

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    9. I'm just elaborating your circles. I didn't create them, I'm just following. But don't you love the attention?

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    10. BTW Kany, I don't discard people because they're different, idiot. I discard them for the same reason your husband would. They'll drag me under. I surgically remove their impact from my psyche.

      Oh, and thank you for the attention, too. Publicity is publicity.

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    11. "They'll drag me under. I surgically remove their impact from my psyche"

      I beg to differ - hell, you rent out rooms in your brain and to those that offend you. You're such a
      liar.

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    12. Yes, this WAS my pattern. Now I kick them out.

      I am learning to practice what I preach at the same time and it is thrilling!

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    13. I think Monica is using a ghost writer for her last post.

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    14. Yeah, like Eden. :-) you evict tumours and parasites on impact.

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    15. Yes, Kany. I want to be like Eden in that regard.

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    16. Lol. Eden is a parasite for your well being! She fuckin' hates you. And you love her, dote on her, pay attention to her, and believe secretly that you have a sisterly relationship. But you remove any negative forces from your life.

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    17. Anyway it is a glorious day and I need to thank my lord and saviour Jesus and crew for the sun, for my pale and delicate skin is in full bloom this time of year. Bye!

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    18. Rosy cheeked and ready to mingle at 50 how many?

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    19. Monica
      "I am learning to practice what I preach at the same time and it is thrilling"

      Bullshit! "attention" is your thrill.

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    20. Monica
      "the crew?" is your alter egos.

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    21. Where did the rat go?

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    22. Who is the rat?

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    23. Anon 2:23
      The one that craves attention and wants to be impotant. lol

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    24. Oh, good, I was hoping it was me.

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    25. You really think Monica loves me, Mk? That's fucking gross.

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    26. Monica wants you to dress up like her mother and shove her face between your legs. Go ahead monica, deny it. You know it's true.

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    27. She's like your little lost puppy.

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    28. Tell you what Monica.. I'll dress you up like my mom, and let my dad have at you. You seem to like the extreme narcy guys, yeah? And guess what... He's probably not much older than you! :)

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    29. I can tell tall tales, but at the end of the day, I have a wife who brings the meaning of shrew to shouting decibels. I am a drug dealer with a prison record. I am a winner btw

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    30. I have a wife who brings the meaning of shrew to shouting decibels.

      LOL

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  11. @Anon
    Interesting post. My advice would be to leave your wife once your kids have grown up and you wouldn't have to pay plenty for them anymore. Being alone and having no bounderies is extremely liberating. I've never been in long term relationship. I love people around me and being the witty guy but at the end of the day people don't really interest me and I prefer to be alone. Relationships only last as long as they are useful to me, most of the time that's a very short period of time.

    I also never had a stable job, thank god. I often move and live a comfortable parasitic lifestyle. I use everything that comes along my way, from people to social security and free lawyers, most of the time to spit them in the eye in the end and leave them trampled knowing they were just a tool to me.

    I enjoy life to the fullest. Being alone and having no morals and feelings of guilt or shame has been a real blessing to me.

    @How to heal ...
    Your post is typical for theoretical knowledge about psychopathy, you think in stereotypes. I myself definitely don't think in black and white, on the contrary. Although I must say my educational background could play a major role in that. If I feel anger (which happens very often) it's most of the time very short lived. I realize I'm the bastard, and never even complain when I get caught and punished, that's part of the game. And playing the game that is called life, is a very joyful rollercoaster ride.

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    1. How To Heal a PDJuly 14, 2012 at 5:29 AM

      @How to heal ...
      Your post is typical for theoretical knowledge about psychopathy, you think in stereotypes. I myself definitely don't think in black and white, on the contrary

      Thank you for responding, as I hope to have a discussion.

      Let me explain, as it is a hard concept to get across, and one that the person must see from his own heart. If not, he will be blind to it.

      If one thinks in black and white, he will not see it. That is part of the dilemma, here.

      Lets say you, for example. You see someone as useful or not useful. THAT is black and white thinking.

      Are you with me, so far?

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    2. Thanks for the reply and the advice. The idea is to leave once the kids are gone. The marriage was a logical conclusion since we had already created the kid. i couldn't be seen as someone who couldn't take care of his family, that would have driven me to self-loathing, addictions, and eventually incarceration. I love me too much me to go to jail. So I joined the infantry and made 20 years of it (like I said the actual job changes every few years). A few more kids came along the way and the youngest is 3. I think he's got about ten good years before I roll. I have also become rather accustom to a decent life style; not great or lavish, but decent. And I can't go back to a trailer unless I WANT to go back to a trailer. Hope that makes sense. Again, me being seen as losing at his marriage and being forced to live below the means I have bee accustom would be such a blow to my image that I would resort to illegal means to establish myself and eventually be incarcerated.

      Some might say because I have such fore thought for the outcomes of my actions that I may not be a sociopath; I keep drawing back to my lack of regard for others with no sense of guilt which allows me to control the situations for my advantage. What do you think? Mind you I don't care if I am or not, I know what I am and do. I was just wondering what you might think.

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    3. I think it makes sense you choose marriage because you knew otherwise you would end up addicted and incacerated (I hit rock bottom once, but crawled up in no time). There's no such thing as 'the psychopath', I think there are as many variations as there are psychopaths. And without any doubt social background and education also plays a huge role in the final outcome and lifestyle, as do many other factors.

      On the other hand you mention shame twice("shame" and "image), that's odd to me (but I'm only comparing you to the sole psychopath I know, and that's myself). But on the contrary to myself your welfare is woven into your social situation, so your well being is dependent on your image and status, so it could be more about discomfort and unease about your own well being than it is about shame. In my case shame is completely lacking, even in front of a judge with people in the room (got caught a few times for pitty crime).

      I couldn't imagine being dependent on a family and other people for my well being, I need my freedom. I couldn't tell from these few post if you are a socio/psychopath or not, after all I'm not a psychiatrist.

      I think to be a psyhopath there needs to be a true inner evil, not just a will to act evil but a true evil soul (I know that sounds silly but I'm just trying to describe something really difficult here). To enjoy to use someone and treat them really bad, while you don't hate that person, maybe you even liked him or her. But just for your own benefit and for the fun of celebrating your own superiority by treating someone like dirt and showing that you can, leaving the dirt behind totally indifferently, moving on to the next thrill.

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    4. Ortho
      I propose that all humans have that "evil" part of themselves, even the sweetest, church going, white haired lady. Do you agree?

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    5. "I propose that all humans have that evil part ..."

      That just sounds like a platitude, I don't care.

      All I care about is the fact that my lack or extremely low empathy, lack of guilt or shame, being amoral and being aware of all that in a very lucid way gives me a perception of life that most people cannot even start to comprenhend, and it gives me advantages that are priceless (hear the narcissist in the psychopath filling up like a pompous balloon here?).

      Many will say that you're poor without without empathy, these are small words from small people, that need to defend their weakness. I watch and giggle at the all the misery that comes with their empathic feelings.

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    6. Again, thanks for the insight. You bring up a good point. I don't know if it's shame or the self-perspective that I lost. I can't stand to lose. It makes me very angry and can come at a great cost when I think I'm about to lose. Once that realization sets in that a loss is about to hit, I usually change my interest and move on to the next viable source for whatever it is I was doing to begin with. I can say that I don't actually feel gratification or satisfaction for what I do to others, I just don't feel guilt or remorse about it either. I only feel "bad" when I don't get what it was I wanted or get caught in the process of getting it. Thanks again for the insight and thoughtful banter.

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    7. This comment has been removed by the author.

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    8. That other Anon wasn't me: I could give a hoot as to what good or evil parts others have.

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    9. Orthodox, you're a loser. Couch surfing and joblessness don't make you smar, unique, interesting, or cool.

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    10. did you ever hear of one finger pointing toward someone and three pointing back?

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  12. @anon
    Btw yes many posts made on this site are interesting, so are the comments that M.E. makes. But when you are a psychopath and live the life you don't go around chatting about it as some harmless psychological characteristic.
    Unless you present it that way and the people simply have no clue what psychopathy is. But even then if you truely are one it absolutely makes no sense.

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    1. I like you, Ortho. We don`t have many people sounding like real sociopaths around here. I`ll be following your posts. You should come to the forum and introduce yourself there too...

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    2. No, FB
      We need him in the comment section. He took care of
      Monica quite well.......:}

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    3. Lol is no answer.

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  13. Why doesn't my forum name show up here? Not intentionally anon

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    1. You have to use a blogger account, bro.

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  14. I like what ortho said about there being no such thing as a sociopath- I have not been around here long but I am impressed by the heterogeneity. There are definite differences in some ways despite all sharing the lack of empathy thing. This seems like a field in its infancy. Ortho- can you describe what beauty means to you?

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  15. Ortho


    1. You mentioned feeling joyful. Do you mainly feel happy? If so, what is the downside, if any, such as boredom etc

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    1. Scroll up. It is not your mother's orthodics.

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  16. Green Eyes
    I want to thank you. You showed me how much rage I had. I have been putting it into my stomach and into depression. I am not quite sure what to do with it, but fucking with people who mess with my boundaries is as good a start as any.

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  17. Dexter was not a psychopath. I don't know why you keep using him as an example M.E. after all the time being here. The man is a loner and is not manipulative whatsoever. He follows a moral code and sees visions of his dead father who brainwashed him. I find it funny that you cry about people classifying psychopaths as serial killers yet you call someone on TV a psychopath JUST because they are a serial killer. Did you see the episode where he kills the car salesmen? Before he kills him he asks him how he can lie so easily, that's a question you would never hear a psychopath ask.

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    1. Really? Why wouldn't a psycho ask such a question? I would think even individuals with such a disorder can be inquisitive. Or do you, UK, have the above all and all knowing knowledge of every psychopath?

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    2. And just for the arguement, Dexter is a fictional character who was written to be a psychopath. So says the shows plot synopsis:

      "During the day, Dexter Morgan is a jovial employee in the Miami Metropolitan Police Department's crime lab, but his meticulously crafted life masks his true nature. In reality Dexter is a disciplined and murderous psychopath (a self-admitted "monster"), and he slakes his blood lust at night by carefully killing the serial killers he tracks down during the day. Based on the novels (Darkly Dreaming Dexter, Dearly Devoted Dexter and Dexter in the Dark) by Jeff Lindsay."

      So, I think you miss the mark completely.

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    3. Because a psychopath would be the best liar out there. They don't ask questions asking how to lie like that to seem normal. That's the reason he asked the guy the question. It was because he couldn't make his life look normal and his lies were obvious. Psychopaths seem more normal than most people out there, without effort. They lie without effort. It's second nature to them.

      Psychopaths are not some weird loner that talks to hallucinations. There is almost nothing that classifies Dexter as a psychopath in that show. He has a conscience, he does not have a high self esteem, he seldom can manipulate anyone, he can't lie well, he has a steady job, he's quasi-asexual, and he's completely been manipulated by his adopted father who used him as his own personal executioner.

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    4. Show me exactly how Dexter would score above a 30 on the PCLR not some plot synopsis you pulled off wikipedia. To hollywood anyone that compulsively murders people is a psychopath. In reality, in actual studies done on psychopaths by actual psychologists, it couldn't be further from the truth.

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    5. It was IMDB not wikipedia, but no matter. That's what the show is sold to be. If you base your interpretation of what a psychopath is because he asked how he could lie like that is VERY weak. It's more than possible a psychopath such as Dex may very well be trying to understand how they themselves are able to be so deceitful. Next, you can not necessarily judge a highly function psychopath based off of test scales that have been derived by accumulating data from DIS-functioning psychos who have been incarcerated. Furthermore, who are you to say what all psychopaths are or aren't? Perhaps based upon mis-encouters or close friendships with people of an antisocial disorder of some sort has made you the end all? Just asking.

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    6. No I base it in the totality of the entire show. The entire show where he shows no aspects of psychopathy. The show where he blames himself for his dead wife and his dead father. The show where he follows a moral code of only killing bad guys. The show where he has a stable job in the police department, desires to change into a family man, gets bossed around by his wife, his girlfriends, that prosecutor, and that cunt that sent him on some vengeance mission.

      Yes, you must be right. Using a widely used test like the PCL-R that was built from decades of studying psychopaths in a clinical setting is ridiculous. Instead we should use a fictional character written for audiences to sympathize with.

      I base my knowledge of psychopaths off of empirical research done by actual psychologists. Not a television show.

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    7. Laughable you would still lean towards a regimented test scale based off of those who have been misfortunate to fail at life within society to determine the legitimacy of those who have succeeded. But then again, I think I had a similar conversation concerning fictional TV shows. Once a AniTrek-ee tried to explain to me how warp drive wasn't possible and it made all the Star Trek shows just unbelievable. It was a friggin show. Same with Dexter. I'm just telling you that the show is based upon a psychopath, so say the writers. And I am not basing anything off of fictional characters. I merely try to conceive an individual LIKE the fictional character and then go with that. Your push that he isn't psycho enough because he inquired into the habits of another deeply disturbed individual with a clear social disorder just doesn't cut it. Now, subject of his established moral code maybe another subject all together.

      But I have been working on a theory. Perhaps some, maybe most, sociopaths/psychopaths establish a "hang up" per se along their way. Some might be small animals where as others might be small children, churches, or pencils. Whatever the object, this will be spared the tempest of the sociopath's world as much as they can. Just a thought. Because of this a developed "personal moral code" would not be totally unlikley for a high-functiong psychopath in our society. In fact, it maybe the safety mechanism that keeps the path from getting caught. Because regardless of the path or the game, the end result is to get away with everything you can for as little as possible.

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    8. I base my opinion off of professional researchers who have devoted their life to studying psychopathy. What I find laughable is that you develop theories on a disorder you clearly have no understanding of, based on a TV show. That's what is laughable.

      I gave you multiple reasons why dexter isn't a psychopath not one. You haven't given me any reason at all to tell me how he would be considered a psychopath. None, except a synopsis from IDMB. If you actually read any books written by Cleckley or Hare who are widely recognized in the field as experts on psychopaths you will see a whole different character than someone like Dexter who fits more of a Schizoid than any other type of disorder.

      Delete
    9. I base my theories on my research (I am currently in graduate school seeking my Masters in Behavioral Psychology, thank you very much) and what IS laughable is your reliance on your subject picks of information from other's research where there is MASSIVE amounts we don't know when it concerns Anti Social Personality Disorders, especially psychopathy. Not every criminal is a psychopath but every psychopath is a criminal who has a total disregard for others in their own personal pursuits other than what others may do for them. In this case Dexter has shown tendencies of this. Again, I'm not saying this fictional character is anything other than what the writers intended it to be; and frankly I don't give a fuck about Dexter I haven't watched the show since season 3. My beef with you was your apparent all encompassing knowledge of what a psychopath is or isn't when there are so many out there that you or anyone else have any clue about and exactally how they can do what they do.

      Delete
    10. Further more, the character Dexter could very possibly suffer from more than more personality disorder. Just a thought.

      Delete
    11. A student seeking their masters....Oh. Well I guess I shouldn't question anything you just said. What a joke.


      My beef with you was your apparent all encompassing knowledge of what a psychopath is or isn't when there are so many out there that you or anyone else have any clue about and exactally how they can do what they do.


      You haven't shown me any research to contest what I've said. In fact you haven't done anything but fire off your random doubts into other people's research who actually have real degrees and real experience. Something you lack. You shoot down psychologists who have done research for over 30 years on psychopaths, as a student with no experience in the field. How many published clinical studies on psychopaths have you conducted personally to develop your thesis to contest the PCL-R? How many law enforcement agencies have you worked with?

      Psychopaths are rarely comorbid and definitely not comorbid with Schizoid Personality Disorder.

      Delete

    12. and what IS laughable is your reliance on your subject picks of information from other's research where there is MASSIVE amounts we don't know when it concerns Anti Social Personality Disorders, especially psychopathy


      I defer to experts who study psychopathy, not the arrogance of some fly by night student who has no experience or degree. You go off what you DO know not what we don't. That's backwards thinking. You take research already done and build on it. I'm surprised you didn't learn that as a freshman.

      Delete
    13. You mock my scholastic journey... petty, and it's not that I'm a student that should cause you not to question me; It's the fact I'm me. I have at least taken the journey. Should you like I'll take the next few to establish some links that may look at the lack of information about Anti Social Personality Disorders. It's not the years of research that others have made that I scoff, I am thankful for their research. It's just that I have done enough to know that many of todays theories are in question. New science, new technology, and a brand new look at society because of both have allowed us to break old paradigms and see that what we though were disorders may not be disorders at all. There is one theory that suggest sociopathy to be the evolutional key to the survivability of the human race; strong emotional attachments might be the disorder. But keep your reading an your obsession with a TV show. Like I said before, I don't give a fuck about "Dexter"; then again... I don't actually give a fuck about anything or anyone, to include your subjective opinions, UK. This has just been a little fun to stir your up your soup and pass some time until I go to work.

      Delete
    14. There is one theory that suggest sociopathy to be the evolutional key to the survivability of the human race;

      Send me the link for that research. All I've heard from you so far is personal opinions wrapped in the word thesis or theory. In other words: Bollocks.

      I'm not the one obsessed with dexter. I was scoffing at him. You were the one defending the character of that show. Let's stay on topic since this is what you were arguing with me about. Tell me dexters traits that would sum up to a 30 score on the PCL-R. That is the current model accepted by law enforcement, psychologists, researchers, and the courts.

      Delete
    15. GOODNESS!!! you still going on about a test that has been derived from ONE subject test-bed, those who have been institutionalized. Although the test does have some validity it is biased. The link: http://human-nature.com/nibbs/01/psychopathy.html. This will get you started until I can find the article title I read a few years back. Also, take a look at "I, Psychopath" a documentary. Both will get you going. Again, these are just theories and hypothesis that still remain to be disproven as well as proven.

      Now, take your bullocks and go. Go learn. Pray you never have dealings with an extreme psychopath. But most importantly, just go.

      Delete
    16. Oooo... this ones going to be a good one. I can just feel it. :)

      Delete
    17. Perhaps, Eden. But I am getting bored.

      Delete
    18. I've had a lot of dealings with psychopaths in my line of work. You assume too much. I saw 'I, Psychopath" a long time ago. I don't need lecturing from someone like you: A complete muppet. You think psychopaths will help in the survival of the human race? You remind me of this nut case therapist that came on here called Stav, and his theory of Pempathy. Complete rubbish.

      You keep putting down the PCL-R as a tool to measure psychopathic traits in an individual yet you have not given any alternative. It's pretty common for arrogant people to do that. They like to look more intelligent by putting down other people's work and ideas, yet have no alternative. Like that link you just sent me. Ian Pitchford is not an expert in psychopathy. He is a Evolutionary Psychologist. There are plenty ankle biters and wing nuts who criticize the PCL-R with no alternative to it. Who cares. Right now the PCL-R is the most accurate and recognized tool to test the traits of a psychopath. It's used around the world by experts in the field. People that have more experience than you. It is the work of decades of research. Hare didn't just do research in prisons either. He went out to corporations and interviewed top executives, where he also found a number of psychopaths.

      They have a prototypical test they proposed at the symposium in Norway November last year called the CAPP. If you want to show me how Dexter measures as a psychopath on that test, by all means show me.

      Delete
    19. I was jogging. Don't get your hopes up

      Delete
    20. Thank you for continuing the game. As much as you say I assume, you tend to put thoughts in my head or words in my mouth. I don't think psychopathy will save the human race, I merely gave an example of how little we really know and how new the study of the mind is. Congrats on your line of work allowing you to deal with psychopaths. My line of work actually sees highly probable suspected sociopaths gravitate towards each other. I know many first hand and they have no idea they might be psychopathic.

      And now: our original beef was that you made a presumption about the fictional character Dexter NOT being a psycho all because he asked the question of the car salesman (I know how to stay on point). I complete disagreed because I thought it very plausible that a psychopath may be inquisitive as to what makes others so easily lie in perhaps an attempt to understand themselves or maybe to better hone their skills. I still say to base your opinion on that question is complete bullshit. However, you have shown that you are educated, although only from biased data and second hand info it would seem, and applaud you for that. Now, if you will get off of an antiquated test and defend the position that NO psychopath would wonder why someone else lies I would like to still play this game. If not... you might win.

      Delete
    21. UKan Stick It In Your CAPPJuly 14, 2012 at 6:45 PM

      You think you know your own cap, let alone the caps of men greater than you. I was in one of Hare's studies. He told me from his own cap, how he calculated his mentality.
      I don't need a muppet like you who has probably never seen the inside of his own hat, let alone mine, to tell me, pygmy.

      Delete
    22. I'm not exactly sure what that was you were trying to convey on that last post (or who you were); but you bring up the word muppet and at that moment it occurred to me UKan has used a more than one figurative monicker to describe me and issued much assault without much evidence of his own other than his knowledge of certain test (which many no longer agree with; hence the development of the CAPP). Name calling and counter-asses to me seem to be very weak approaches to an educated argument.

      Delete
    23. No we were talking about whether Dexter is a psychopath or not. You seem to keep going back to one example. I gave you several examples of why he is not.

      1 He was manipulated by his father his entire life. Even after his father died.

      2 He was manipulated by his wife to change his life, he was manipulated by the crazy girl, he was manipulated by the prosecutor turned killer, and he was manipulated by some rape victim. Not once. Continuously they manipulated him episode after episode to kill for their personal vendettas or follow their prerogatives. You would not find a sociopath in existence that would give up power like that. In a relationship with a psychopath you would have very little power, even over yourself.

      3 He doesnt know how to lie. The car salesmen incident. He said he wished he knew how to lie like the car salesmen did, which he couldn't since his whole life was coming to the surface at the time. That was the reason he asked. Psychopaths lie without thought to their lie. Their confidence and charisma carry the lie more than how believable the lie actually is. In fact studies have been done where psychopaths will tell a lie that makes absolutely no sense whatsoever and the clinician was still fooled. It was only because there was a second and third observer that the lie was seen for what it was (Snakes with Suits -Robert Hare).

      4 Dexter is not grandiose. He is a willing pawn always looking for someone to guide him.

      5 Dexter is not confidant. He was afraid of his relationship with Rita. Afraid she would reject him after they finally had sex.

      6 Dexter is not impulsive at all. He is actually very compulsive with OCD. Everything to him must be perfect. Everything must be executed according to plan and his fathers code. His house needs to be extremely neat. His work needs to be done to a science. Psychopaths are poor long term planners with low impulse control.

      7 He hallucinates. Psychopaths don't suffer from hallucinations. He is a serial killer that has visions from his dead father who raised him to be a murderer. Psychopaths are "absent of delusions and irrational thinking (Cleckley, Mask of Sanity)."

      8 He has guilt for his dead wife, blaming himself. He has guilt for accidently hurting innocent people. His hallucinations feed him guilt on a constant basis drilling in Harrys Code and admonishing him for any transgression.

      There's a few examples.

      Delete

    24. I'm not exactly sure what that was you were trying to convey on that last post (or who you were);


      People imitate me. Follow the username icon and you won't go wrong. I don't sound retarded like that. You are still a muppet though.

      CAPP is not widely used at all. It is still a prototype. Like I said use either one. Show me exactly how Dexter fits into the category of psychopath.

      Delete
    25. This guy just keeps going. I think you may have gotten off point. My whole beginning to this thing was because of that initial question. I said more than once I don't give a fuck about Dexter, or your opinion, or anything really. I'm bored and you are proving to be fun. Thank you... Muppet.

      Now. I told you I haven't seen an episode since season 3. You have vastly much more knowledge than me about Dexter, I concede. Your knowledge and experience with psychopaths remains to be seen (and just for your info; you are failing miserably). So Dexter is yours... he's not a fucking psycho. Happy?

      Here's a real question for you (and mind you, this could get really fun): Why, UKan, do you come to this site?

      Delete
    26. Ukan B OutlandishJuly 14, 2012 at 7:24 PM

      Talk about monikers. I have them all: muppet, humper, thumper and dry wall. Do you think you know me? Guess again, dry wall. I come here because I go everywhere. You look behind you, I will be there. You look next to you, I will be in your room. Does that answer your retarded question, loser?

      Delete
    27. What you are doing is trying to divert the conversation because you got trapped into proving your point, which you can't. You are now trying to take control of the conversation which I won't let you do. Have a good day.

      Delete
    28. If that's the way you see it, I beg to differ and I think the conversation proves itself. From the very beginning I asked what made you the all knowing expert on psychopaths based solely upon your first post. I traveled down your rabbit hole for fun and you obliged. I concede you know more about a TV show than me. Now I ask a serious question and you avoid. Defensive tactics through the argument and now avoidance... hmm, what can we conclude about that?

      Why do you come here?

      Delete
    29. UKan B Outlandish: I hope you get cancer and die a very slow and miserably painful death. Just kidding. you're funny and really not worth the energy to wish such a thought on.

      Delete
    30. UKan Stick it in Your CappJuly 14, 2012 at 7:38 PM

      What about me, Gungy?

      Delete
    31. Um... What about you? If it was self approval you need validated by a complete unknown; well, come my children. Come and I will validate. he he.

      Delete
    32. UKan Talk From Your Butt TooJuly 14, 2012 at 7:52 PM

      I be talking from the wrong end. I am UKan.

      Delete
    33. No you are short cutting instead of doing your own work by asking me what my motivations are. Questions are the way to control conversations. I'm not here to give you personal details of how I think or what motivates me. I know what you are trying to do. That only works on suckers.

      The conversation was never about me being the all knowing anything, because I never made such a claim. I said Dexter is not a psychopath. You argued with me and then I told you why I hold that opinion. You conceded. Game over. Have fun playing with the retarded troll.

      Delete
    34. And you still avoid. Whether you know what I'm doing or not is irrelevant. The fact is you won't answer the question. I've seen your other sophomoric post and I ask you a reasonable adult oriented question and you refuse to answer.

      And yes, my whole point was based upon you not thinking a psychopath would ask how someone could lie so easily. That's not diversion, that's fact. Scroll up and read. And you still haven't defended that position. Yes, I conceded that you know more about a TV show than me and by logical deduction you would know better than I if Dex was a psycho; however, the writers still say he's suppose to be (LOL!). You keep trying to drift to ares that you feel comfortable and can accuse me of different presumptions.

      Come clean: why do you come here? (based upon your other responses to other peoples post I suspect it is they who you don't want to know the truth.)

      Delete
    35. I think people here know a lot more about the truth than you do. So you are wrong.

      Are you talking about Monica? Her mother molested her. She has repeatedly related Eden to her mother. Give me your opinion, Gungy: Does Monica have sexual fantasies about Eden?

      Delete
    36. Answer mine first... then I would be happy to opine:-)

      Delete
    37. We are bargaining now Gungy? I thought you were bored. How boring is it to flail around in conversation, without subtlety? You asking me about what my motivations are is like walking up to a girl and telling her that you want to stick your cock in her mouth. Why don't we start off with some casual impersonal conversation?

      Delete
    38. So says the subtle... No. I just wanted you to post twice more after having the audacity to think for one moment you were ever in control of this conversation. i flat out told you to go for the whole moral thing with Dexter. I told you I don't give a fuck about your opinion. Scroll up. It's all there. Yes, I am bored. You posted twice. Thank you for playing. Goodnight.

      Delete
    39. Monica has sexual fantasies about one person on SW and one only and it is not Eden

      Delete

    40. No. I just wanted you to post twice more after having the audacity to think for one moment you were ever in control of this conversation.


      Oh I wasn't. Why did you say?:


      I traveled down your rabbit hole for fun and you obliged.


      Your in my rabbit hole mate. In my rabbit hole I'm always in control.

      Delete

    41. Monica has sexual fantasies about one person on SW and one only and it is not Eden


      I didn't know Monica's mum had an account at Sociopathworld.

      Delete
    42. WOW! That was a weird read. UKan, you got played Boy.

      Delete
    43. shut the fuck up Monica!

      Delete
    44. I just hope Gungy is kidding and keeps this thing going.

      Delete
    45. I submit.

      Delete
    46. My mother fingered me. I liked it, what can I say.

      Delete
    47. Why did I just read all that? Time I'll never get back.

      Delete
    48. Damn. I was getting into that.

      Delete
    49. Monica wishes to fuck M.E.
      Too bad he only collects the best of specimen when it comes to body and mind. Guess you're shit out of luck there, Monica.

      Delete
    50. Where were you about a half hour ago, Eden? You might have kept these two ranting all night.

      Delete
    51. Oh? How do you figure that?

      Delete
    52. Gungy ended with a comment about you/ You seemed to egg them a little earlier in the post. Thought you might have spurred them on before we lost the. Oh, well.

      Delete
    53. A fantasy is just a fantasy, Eden. You should know that they don't have to come true. You have lived in delusion long enough to know that fact.

      Delete
    54. Fantasies can be goals.

      Delete
    55. I guess I didn't catch that.
      Well... better late than not at all. If Gungy would like to come hang out for a little while more, I'm here. What the hell is a Gungy anyway?

      Delete
    56. No, fantasies are glorious loves that never come true. If they did, they would not be glorious.

      Delete
    57. "A fantasy is just a fantasy, Eden. You should know that they don't have to come true. You have lived in delusion long enough to know that fact."

      On the contrary. If I've been living in delusions, I wouldn't know the facts at all. Nice try though, Monica.

      Delete
    58. Have you read the books? he is darker there. He doesn't care about people, he just likes her sister, but when his brother asked if he wanted to kill her, he almost couldn't resist to play (If I remember right, he didn't decided, he was interrupted). He doesn't love Rita, he just uses her to seem normal and he finds her annoying and stupid. He also doesn't kill that quickly, he likes playing with his preys. The TV show is censored and modified in order to get more audience.

      Delete
  18. Such interesting topics.. I've deconstructed the definition so much that I am not sure how unique psychopathy is anymore. If Dexter is a psychopath that can "mimic" non disordered thinking, how much of a psychopath is he? Wouldn't a true psychopath not be able to comprehend these things, ever? The blending that is often spoke of sounds more like self conning. Like a self aware person struggling with their lighter side, their perceived weaker one. Also, empathy has to be taught.. So, is it fair to say that we are all born parasites? I think so. We have to learn how to become human. Sometimes we unlearn, or become disordered. Which is still part of the human experience. If we look hard enough, we can find classic psychopathic evidence in all of human history. Its the degrees of it in a person that make it label worthy.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Shut the fuck up, Monica!

      Delete
    2. (continuing) I think whats more interesting than ME's vision of a sociopath, is what she/he views an person with empathy to be. Ever notice the extreme polarization? Its indicative of ME's high standards for his/her self. ME has high standards for the world and the world has fallen short, and s/he has deliberately punished the world by taking on the identity of a Sociopath. A powerful, mysterious projectable label to hide behind. He/she made this blog as a safe place to learn and process. Because, deep down ME has unanswered questions. Just like we all do.

      Delete
    3. continuing...
      Now your speaking for ME?

      Delete
    4. How so? Only ME can speak for ME. And I can make observations.

      Delete
  19. Dexter is really interesting in that he has not split away his evil side the way normal people do. In fact he meets it head on- is in some ways he is an extremely whole person. Normal people by virtue of the world we live in have to split off their dark side to sustain the self-image of themselves as a good christian, good jew, good whatever. That is partly what makes so many people so full of angst. On a deep level they know they are full of shit. Morality should be driven by something deeper than what is legal or religiously sanctioned. Dexter is amoral but has figured out that some people do not deserve to live, and that he can have his cake and eat it too by targeting killers.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies

    1. Dexter is amoral but has figured out that some people do not deserve to live, and that he can have his cake and eat it too by targeting killers.

      That's not amoral.

      Delete
    2. Anon 2:28
      Be careful when examining the lives of normal people when you have no experience in that area.

      Delete
    3. Anon aka Monica 2:28
      Amoral is an adjective not a noun.

      Delete
  20. Themes

    Really, Themes, you find 50 year old's sexy?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Themes
      Or do you believe in miracles? :}

      Delete
    2. Themes is Monica.

      Delete
    3. Themes is..............................

      Theme Song for Themes

      Delete
    4. ^She's like the Twitter Quote

      A good rat has more than one hole.....lol

      Delete
    5. I think i'm in love

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dlpgNsJsNKI

      Delete
    6. Throw up and throw up again........

      Delete
    7. Like you lust after Eden?

      Delete
    8. What are you talking about?

      Delete
    9. anon6:26 bitches aint shit but hoes and tricks.

      Delete
    10. I can't follow any of this shit from Anon6:26 down. Can one of you hoes help me out?

      Delete
    11. i thought it was selfishly sweet.

      Delete
    12. Shut the fuck up, Monica

      Delete
    13. anon 9:02 i think someone is hitting on either M.E., Themes, or an0n 4:11.

      Delete
    14. definatly not monica.

      Delete
    15. OK this shit be hard to follow

      Delete
    16. ^Monica's alter egos.......

      Delete
    17. monica hasn't posted in forever this discusion has nothing to do with her.

      Delete
  21. On the event of Themes death, he will leave it in his will to tell his beloved SW of his identity. Until, then he remains true to his Theme.

    ReplyDelete
  22. Does anyone else get the sinking feeling you are being sucked into a spider web spun by just one multi=personality disordered individual with the occasional fellow fly being sucked in?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. And your opinion is?

      Delete
    2. No you might need medicine... or a gun.

      Delete
    3. Oh. I think the possibility is very real.

      Delete
    4. i have a gun. I'm looking for my target.

      Delete
    5. Who is the individual?

      Delete
    6. fellow fly lmfao

      Delete
    7. I have no idea who the individual is. I thin it very well maybe you, or another anon, or some other anon, or Monica, or Eden, or ME, or.... I'm so fucking lost it hurts my head.

      Delete
    8. Calm down old girl you just have to "try to make it through..."

      Delete
    9. ^Sounds like one of Monica's friends from the movie
      "Help."

      Delete
    10. You mean "The Help"

      Delete

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