Sunday, September 8, 2013

Boundaries: help or hindrance?

A reader asked about her sociopathic-seeming significant other, bringing up an interesting point about boundaries:
He knows he has thing's inside of him that work different from most people. I don't like to say, "normal" because to me, he is pretty normal or tries to go with the flow as much as he possibly can. I know to always be on my guard, and I have noticed that if I seem more like it does not bother me and if I am more stern with my remarks and answers, he seems to like that. Is that normal I suppose.
I don't know if I can speak for all sociopaths on this point, but I myself like well-defined boundaries, at least in personal relationships that I am interested in maintaining, and it sounds like he is the same. It is a little unusual for a sociopath to be in such a long relationship. By now he no longer derives most of his pleasure in the relationship from the constant acquisition of power, through playing games with you, seducing you, etc. You must provide something else to him that he values enough to try to keep the relationship working, whether stability, a front/beard/respectability, money, someone to take care of his kids, intimacy, or any other number of things. Basically you are still a profitable endeavour for him -- he may pay $100K a month to keep the thing running, but he gets at least $101K a month in return, so he'll keep that up forever. In other words, his brain is constantly running a cost benefit analysis of staying with you: all the time and effort it takes and possible negative consequences ($100K) compared to all of the benefit he receives ($101K). Just like a business, he might let things dip into the red here and there on a bad month, but ultimately will not continue seeing you if he sees it as a losing endeavor.

You being stern helps him keep the account in the black by reducing expenses. There is always going to be a certain amount of waste in a business, including breakage of merchandise, worker injuries, broken machinery, or hurt feelings. To fix that, businesses establish rules to promote optimum precautionary measures. For instance, instead of the business paying thousands of dollars to replace broken merchandise, they institute rules about putting breakable merchandise on the bottom shelf. Simple measures like properly training workers and forcing them to wear safety equipment (boundaries), can keep costs down and a business solvent. You are performing the same function with him when you establish boundaries. Instead of little things building up until you melt down emotionally (broken machinery), you are training him how to properly operate your machinery, so to speak.

Of course he will still do some things to hurt the business intentionally for his own gain, maybe the emotional equivalent of embezzling money, but when he does those things intentionally, he has no problem with them. Just because he kicks around the furniture one time does not mean that he wants to be accidentally stubbing his toe two weeks later. So some "stern" things you say will just make him angry and defensive, but if your sternness is just a matter of routine maintenance to prevent catastrophe, he will welcome any advice from you just as you would welcome the advice of a trusted mechanic.

45 comments:

  1. Now I know why I dump some people so fast.

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  2. Crap, I wanted to say first

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    1. VEGITOPATH MADLY IN LOVE WITH MONICA AND UKANSeptember 9, 2013 at 7:27 PM

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    2. VEGITOPATH MADLY IN LOVE WITH MONICA AND UKANSeptember 9, 2013 at 7:41 PM

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    3. VEGITOPATH MADLY IN LOVE WITH MONICA AND UKANSeptember 9, 2013 at 7:42 PM

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  3. What the fuck, He said : You must provide something else to him that he values enough to try to keep the relationship working, whether stability, a front/beard. Now read that and look at the particular word beard and it's context... So she brings a beard to attract him in the relationship

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    1. You must provide something else to him that he values enough to try to keep the relationship working, whether stability, a front/beard/respectability, money, someone to take care of his kids, intimacy, or any other number of things.

      Look at the complete context.

      She paints the classical respective "holy family context". I find front and respectability the most significant in this context. The beard only seems to function as a symbol.

      Does intimacy stand in for sexuality? The "sexual duties" of the wife added to the whole division of labor context? Vicarious satisfaction. Lots of economic imagery but puritanically nothing about specific part of the equation.

      I know that is only me. My twopence/tuppence only. ;)

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    2. VEGITOPATH MADLY IN LOVE WITH MONICA AND UKANSeptember 9, 2013 at 7:30 PM

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    3. VEGITOPATH MADLY IN LOVE WITH MONICA AND UKANSeptember 9, 2013 at 7:31 PM

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    4. Annoying maybe to some, not to me though just shows the need for attention and how much you crave it. Shows weakness, perhaps you should work on your desires as you will only met with suffering with your neediness on full display. ;)

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  4. I don't think this analogy to "investment" is novel to just sociopaths. Empaths work the same way in the emotional sense.

    I've often heard the analogy of relationships as compared to a banking account - more specifically when raising children. Overall, you make emotional deposits: comfort, support, validation, love, physical affection.

    As parents, sometimes you slip and lose your temper with your kids. If the emotional balance is high enough, you can afford to make this kind of withdrawal. However, if you continually abuse your authority, your children are being raised within a deficient environment. Equals: not cool.

    The same, I suppose, applies to grown up relationships (though I'm not too good at those, as I tend to invest in bad checking accounts). But I'm a great mom, so I'll stick with what I know!

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    1. I agree BizyLizy. The general problem, if you create two categories, "normals" and "psychopath" who necessarily live in the same world.

      If I understand correctly, I wish you had been my mother. She may have invested in a economically good checking account, but her problems with her husband, my father, never seem to end.

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    2. @ LeaNder-

      I am not surprised that you have mother issues. I know that I have them and it seems quite a few women (including Monica, who you've been mistaken for) on this site do.
      I have a hunch. We learned early that we had to be strong because we did not have mothers we felt confident would keep us out of harms way.
      I've always wondered what it would be like to grow up as a little "princess". In hindsight, I like the independent steak so on some level I am very glad to have had the early nurturing experiences that I had.

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    3. Ha! The Princess experiment was performed in my family.
      My sister was raised as a little princess, myself the opposite.

      She was given more or less anything she wanted.
      Was allowed to do whatever she wanted without any repercussions, bar a little attempted guilting.
      She got herself knocked up to an unbelievable loser by 17. Lived with him, but my parents had to support them both fully.
      She even abused her children, but my parents did everything to hide it from the authorities.

      My point is that she never had to take responsibility for her actions and grew up an incredibly weak and entitled narcissist. Her life has been nothing but one great big disappointment after another :)

      In the fairy tales the princess marries prince charming and lives happily ever after with everyone crapping sunshine and butterflies.
      In real life, Princess is the most miserable bitch you could ever meet. No man, no friends, no job. Whenever someone displeases her, she goes running to mum and demands justice be served to her. Looks to be at least 45, but I kid you not, still wears a name necklace that says "Princess".
      It is hilarious.

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    4. VEGITOPATH MADLY IN LOVE WITH MONICA AND UKANSeptember 9, 2013 at 7:32 PM

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  5. How come it's the first time I see you here

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  6. Ze man, I hope this is the last time we see you here.

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  7. @ BizyLizy : why are you restricting access to your blog ? You don't have anything to fear, it's not like we are a bunch of sociopaths who would hunt you down or anything. Errr, it's not like we are normal superficial humans who wouldn't be able to stand your blog without reporting your sociopathic tendencies to the authorities.

    That being said, I love empaths. They feel so much emotions, and they express it so well... Making an empath fall in love with you and then crushing her pure soul, making it go darker and darker, converting her to the dark side is great. They make fantastic masochists :) But they tend to get boring after a while because they give you everything and voilà...

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    1. VEGITOPATH MADLY IN LOVE WITH MONICA AND UKANSeptember 9, 2013 at 7:35 PM

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  8. Oh, I've been reading ME's site for over a year now. When I have time & if the inclination hits me, I comment every once in a while.

    ME has posted a two part series on our correspondence regarding child custody issues. If you want to read about it, search ME's blog for this topic. I really don't have anything to hide.

    As far as the blog goes, I made it private for personal reasons that include my relationship with the ex.

    But if you email me, I'd be happy to give you access if you are so inclined to know more about me. bizylizygirl @ yahoo dot com

    Honestly, it flatters me that little ol' me is of such an interest. As far as loving empaths, Mr. Decadent, kudos to you. Whatever works to make you happy! You will never be in short supply of willing volunteers, that's for sure...

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  9. Seriously, I don't get it. How is it an advantage for a woman to have a beard

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    1. these freaks get off on it
      (and so do i)

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    2. VEGITOPATH MADLY IN LOVE WITH MONICA AND UKANSeptember 9, 2013 at 7:36 PM



















































































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      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

      TEEEHEEE

      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































      TEEHEEE


































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

      Delete
  10. @Ze:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beard_(companion)

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Ok, interesting. Didn't know that. Makes sense in context.

      Delete
    2. VEGITOPATH MADLY IN LOVE WITH MONICA AND UKANSeptember 9, 2013 at 7:40 PM

      TEEEHEEE

      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

      TEEEHEEE

      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

      TEEEHEEE

      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

      TEEEHEEE

      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

      TEEEHEEE

      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

      TEEEHEEE

      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

      TEEEHEEE

      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

      TEEEHEEE

      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

      TEEEHEEE

      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

      TEEEHEEE

      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

      TEEEHEEE

      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

      TEEEHEEE

      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

      Delete
  11. Ah, makes lots of sense now

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. VEGITOPATH MADLY IN LOVE WITH MONICA AND UKANSeptember 9, 2013 at 7:39 PM

      TEEEHEEE

      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

      TEEEHEEE

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      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

      TEEEHEEE

      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

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      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

      TEEEHEEE

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      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

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      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

      TEEEHEEE

      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

      TEEEHEEE

      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

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      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

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      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

      TEEEHEEE

      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

      TEEEHEEE

      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

      Delete
  12. quit trying to figure out sociopaths by books or logic
    i'm so far outside the box and you think of them like a robot or a computer
    it's bs
    only thing you can Judge them by is behaviour
    and most you can't tell they are a sociopaths
    becouse you can't reducuce there behaviour to an algoridem
    the fucked up part is i do that to other ppl lol

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. sometimes i tell ppl that to there face
      you did this in that case
      in this case you are gonna do the same thing
      (makes them a little mad sometimes)

      Delete
    2. I find it is far more useful to seek behavioral "tells" for narcissism. Many sociopaths are very live and let live, even if they always act in terms of self interest. The smart ones give preference to long term self interest and are less encumbered by poor impulse control. When they have to pull the plug on someone, it's usually an in the moment thing and then they move on.

      Narcissistic types are less able to control their emotions and are hypersensitive to the smallest insult. Their rage is far less rational and unpredictable, and it fuels a belief that betraying you is righteous. They go above and beyond with cruelty because vengeance is demanded by a wounded ego.

      Delete
    3. I doubt, Machiavellianempath, that this is a typical feature of narcism only. Mind you I have been enormously disinterested in what I experienced as a hype of the concept of narcism when it felt there was such a hype in one of my fields of study. On the other hand I was confronted with hypersensitity even playing games with it occasionally.

      Random search: Psychology Now: hypersensitity

      Delete
    4. ditto: in this case you are gonna do the same thing

      Not the absolute proof either you are dealing with a sociopath, necessarily.

      Delete
    5. @ LeaNder- I completely agree that this is not just a problem with the narcissistic type- I should have been more clear that I am framing this in terms of a DSM V diagnostic paradigm. Narcissism is no longer considered a "type"- but narcissistic traits are measured to help diagnose other personality disorders. It's the narcissistic traits, in my mind, that cause vengeful/obsessive behavior. Borderlines, for example, tend to score quite high on narcissistic traits. The main narcissistic trait that a sociopath has is egocentricity. Because high functioning sociopaths often develop cognitive empathy, they can operate with empathy, which is the antithesis of narcissistic behavior. There also does not seem to be the same envy/shame motivation to invest so much in a rigid false self. The fluid identity of a sociopath tends to move on rather than obsess.

      Delete
    6. ^Very astute...

      Delete
    7. Thank you LeaNder!

      Delete
    8. well now isn't that special.. all the above posters confused all readers and now sw is all proud of itself again with it's
      shit pile of confused fucks.

      Delete
    9. VEGITOPATH MADLY IN LOVE WITH UKANSeptember 9, 2013 at 7:37 PM

      TEEEHEEE

      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

      TEEEHEEE

      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

      TEEEHEEE

      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

      TEEEHEEE

      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

      TEEEHEEE

      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

      TEEEHEEE

      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

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      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

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      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

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      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

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      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

      TEEEHEEE

      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

      TEEEHEEE

      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































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      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

      Delete
  13. Sociopaths crush the weak. To them, it's like swating an annoying bug.
    They are perfectly charming until they are crossed. Then watch out!
    A person is simply going to have to ask themselves if all the sex and
    excitement are nessasary.
    Comes a time you have to pay the bill. Just hope you don't have to pay
    with your life.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. and than they go back to dating regular people and get bored

      Delete
    2. VEGITOPATH MADLY IN LOVE WITH MONICA AND UKANSeptember 9, 2013 at 7:38 PM

      TEEEHEEE

      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































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      TEEEHEEE

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      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

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      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

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      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

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      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

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      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

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      ME WANT TOO MAREE MONEECA AND UKAN
























































      TEEHEEE



































































































































































      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

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      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

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      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

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      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

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      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

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      MAREEGE. MONEECA. UKAN. TEEHEE.

      Delete
  14. I am NOT a sociopath and I measure relationships on a give/take ratio. I don't even mind if I give more than I take.

    The last one I dated did not know how to give at all. He wanted to do nothing for me as the relationship progressed. If all I needed was sex, I could use a sex toy.

    ReplyDelete
  15. are you regurgitating entries? ;(

    ReplyDelete
  16. ME: get these idiots off your website

    ReplyDelete

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