Sunday, April 6, 2014

Salt of the earth

I liked this comment on an older post about sociopaths being just a natural human variant:

This is very encouraging to read. It does seem more logical to see there being an intended role in nature for those considered psychopaths rather than being an aberration or flaw.

I think the statistic I read somewhere was that approximately 4% are psychopaths. This seems to be exactly the proportion of managers you'd need for any group. Those that can make hard or even life and death decisions dispassionately for the preservation of their tribe, corporation, or nation. The fact that those same people tend to be gifted with an easy charm to persuade others and that they naturally migrate to positions of power would seem to reinforce this. What would be perceived as evil by the recipient might be seen as good to the group following the psychopath who subsequently have food to eat for the winter, a surplus of wives to mate with, or more valuable stocks.

The fact that I see myself equating the decimation of a rival tribe with acquiring increased stock value is not lost on me. Humorous to me though in it's own way...

Are sociopaths like salt? Even just a little too much can ruin a dish, but if you don't have any you'll eventually die? One of the facts that stuck out to me as a child in social studies class was learning that in certain parts of the world at certain times in history, salt was worth its weight in gold. Has that ever been true of sociopaths in history?

52 comments:

  1. I think this goes for all minorities: socio, autistics, down's, those with extremely high IQs, mentally ill...

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    2. TEHEEEEEEEEEEEEEApril 8, 2014 at 3:32 PM

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  2. Don't forget that socios are using this site to manipulate empaths to believe in theirs needs, such be insert in society as not abnormals, So we should accept or forgive lies, the desire to make you suffer just to watch your expressions changing in your face, violence etc.? The funny thing is that the owner is a narcisist pretending to be a socio... but the site works anyway...

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    1. Don't forget that empaths are using this site to manipulate psychopaths to believe in their narrow point of view, and if anyone is different from themselves they should die a horrible death. So we should accept or forgive emotional abuse, the desire to make you feel like you are not normal and forcing you to fit into their little bubble of understanding of psychopathy? The funny thing is that the anon 304 is a empath pretending to be a psychopathy expert...but the site works anyway

      Delete
    2. I could not agree with you more. This site is about advocacy, acceptance, and justification of bad behavior. Very rarely is anything said about changing it. Cancer could be considered a "natural human variant". But do we strive for acceptance or better treatments and possibility a cure?

      MelissaR

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    3. They say psychopaths and sociopaths have a tendency to be violent and blood thirsty. Ironically, it is only when I hear this type of ignorance talks that I become violent. Never acted on it past elementary school though.

      Or maybe I didn't stop, because you know, I can't sympathize with people and can't learn from mistakes and can't do the right thing and I'm evil.

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    4. Anon 5:33...only you know your truth. Caring about what other's think about you is not the same about caring for other people.

      MelissaR

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    5. MelissaR: "I could not agree with you more. This site is about advocacy, acceptance, and justification of bad behavior."

      If any reasonable person was to read a reasonable sample of the posts on this site, then it would become immediately clear that your statement is a sweeping and opinionated generalisation. That's to say: factually incorrect.

      ----------------

      MeliisaR: " Cancer could be considered a "natural human variant". Another generalised and sweeping comemnt, and one that, were it to be uttered in a similar context by a sociopath, would have empaths frothing and foaming.

      The key thing I've noticed about a signifcant percentage of professed empaths on this site is this: it's not just how illogical, irrational and crudely subjective they are in their thinking, but how relentlessly black and white (i.e. simplistic) they are in their attitudes. It's like (in George W Bush's words) you're either with us or against us.

      ---------------

      MelissaR: "But do we strive for acceptance or better treatments and possibility a cure?" You mean for irrational, illogical and hate-filled empaths? But of course.

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    6. Anon 2:26,

      That's right, my posts contain my opinions. What's your point?

      MelissaR

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    7. MelissaR: "That's right, my posts contain my opinions. What's your point?"
      That you fail (deliberately or otherwise) to see the point I'm making further devalues the validity of your opinions.

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    8. My opinion is now law.

      All differing opinions are hereby invalid, in light of my superior opinion.

      Delete
    9. I'm crying now.

      MelissaR

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  3. Christ said to the early Christians: "Ye are the salt of the earth.
    But if the salt should use it's savor, what is it good for? Only to be
    trodded upon."
    If a risk taking sociopath can apply their passions in a positive way,
    like a rugged individualist in a pioneering situation, all can
    benifit , like in the movie "Shane." starring Alan Ladd. His darked
    suited rival played by Jack Palance is the opposte side of the coin.
    Sociopaths working the right side of the law usually in hazardess
    situations like war and putting down revolts are a boon.
    Trouble is, there's not much market for Soldiers of Fortune in
    peaceful times.

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    3. VEGITOPATH TEEHEEApril 8, 2014 at 3:34 PM

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  4. Do any of you know a single high-functioning psychopath who is all about the good of the tribe? The ones I know are essentially lone operators, albeit with a charming facade, who care only about what is good for themselves. If 'the tribe' benefits from their machinations, it is little more than a happy coincidence. Usually all around them suffer to some degree. Maybe in the days of Genghis Khan, what was good for Khan was good for the tribe but these days, psychopaths have no useful role that I can see.

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    1. Maybe the ones that get identified are always identified because they are harming the society or acting stupid? By this logic, should we believe that all gay men are fruity and all lesbians are manly, because those are the only ones we can identify to be homosexuals without a brain scan?

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    2. I was referring to the ones we identify privately in our own sphere through close observation, not because they are "acting stupid".

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    3. More than likely, the majority of individuals that many people encounter in life who they think are psycho-sociopaths are just people "acting stupid" because the percentage is so small.

      MelissaR

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    4. i agree, mostly it's bullies or narcissists. and any one can have low empathy. one person i know who i think may be psychopathic prefers to blend in the background, is totally charming yet lashes out if you get in her way. But will drop the anger on a dime if it doesn't have any effect, and go back to acting friendly as if nothing is wrong. even knowing that you know she screwed you over. the feelings don't factor in.

      narcissists can't do that. they can dissemble and even manipulate as long as they think you don't know about it, but as soon as they reveal their intentions to you the mask is done. you become official enemies. it's like they feel exposed or something and can't see beyond that.

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    5. Zoe,

      The best defense with any bully is to call them on (label) their behavior. "You're acting like a bully right now and I'm walking away". As soon as they know that you know they are a bully their behavior is no longer effective. They can't stand it and will move on to someone they can bully. And of course from then on you are an enemy, not because of anything you did to them, but because you know who they really are.

      MelissaR

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  5. I think the world, even though they wouldn't admit it they, need us. We wouldn't have air if we didn't need to breath, we wouldn't have water I'd we have to drink and we wouldn't have sociopaths if they didn't serve a purpose. As diverse as people may be everyone serves a purpose. So you preach how we don't strive for change and just want to justify the terrible, horrible, wrongs you don't even know if we commit. This is all based on sociopathic stereotypes.
    You can can say we don't don't want to be a better person but do you know for sure. You can't take what one sociopath says as a unspoken law that sociopaths follow. I'm sure we've had our inner 'do better' lamp flicker before.
    And not all of us need justification for what we do, some not at all, because 60% of the time its all calculated to ensure what we're doing is right. (for us).
    You don't know me or anyone else on this site as a matter of fact. You may know my name or what I look like but do you really know me. Do you really know anyone.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Of course when one is devious and unknowable, one imagines everyone else is too.

      Delete
    2. Wow. Equating your self importance to the human race as air and water? That's pretty far out there.

      MelissaR

      Delete
    3. MelissaR: I don't think that's her point. She's saying everything exists for a reason, otherwise evolution would've gotten rid of psychopaths long ago. I agree the comparison isn't the greatest though.

      I like how Anon 547 ignores everything else and replies only to the thing he/she wants to see lol

      Delete
    4. Anon 7:38

      Evolution is a continual process. It doesn't stop. It's going on right now. There is no end to evolution. What's in existence today could fail to exist in 200, 500 years from now. To say that evolution would've gotten rid of psychopaths (or anything for that matter) already is short-sighted at best.

      MelissaR

      Delete
    5. When it comes to it, deep at our core, we are all as evil and relentless as nature itself. It is just that between the comfort zone and that extreme where emotions are nulled out, the empath feels something until he hits extreme while the psychopaths don't. You might say you could never kill a man, or ruin someone, but you will and you can.

      Delete
    6. The last response actually ended in thew wrong thread. Bummer. To bad I can't edit it. For this thread I was going to write;

      The evolutionary strength of a diverse group is its diversity. As the environment changes around it, or the group moves to different environments, the rules of survival changes. This will favor some members at some point in time, disfavor other members in the same point in time, and then things will shift when times change. If we were all the exact same, then a devistating impact of an environmental change would devistate everyone and wipe us all out.

      Obiously throughout history andevolution it has been alot more benefitial being an empath then sociopath, or else we would not have 96% empaths and neurotypicals on this earth. Howerer psychopaths have had theyr small share of being needed obviously.

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  6. 4%? One in every class is said to be psychopathic. Almost everyone have met psychopathic people. This is a major taboo, media refuses to discuss psychopathic nurses, teachers & doctors. They exist in business & in prisons...end of story!

    ReplyDelete
  7. the problem with being charge is that you sometimes have to make decisions that are good for the group but not good for the leader, and sometimes give up some power. i would guess that's hard for psychopaths to do if there is nothing in it for them.

    i mean if you knew that your position was secure, but you could build a bigger group by giving up power (with next to no recognition or payback) or keep it small and safely screw with people to flex your power over them, which would be more appealing?

    i'm thinking of a real life scenario. can't go into more detail though. but i noticed that while the psychopath in charge is either cool or working to keep anger in check, their narcissistic bully henchman seems to be oozing fear. which is so gross!

    maybe that's one way to distinguish the two? both want power, but the narcissist dances to fear.

    ReplyDelete
  8. "A leader has to create the space for other people to step forward". ` Oprah

    This is where psycho/sociopath gets it wrong and ends as the bully for a boss.

    MelissaR

    ReplyDelete
  9. What about Cleopatra, Queen of Egypt who led her own army?

    Her palace shimmered with onyx and gold but was richer still in political and sexual intrigue. Above all else, Cleopatra was a shrewd strategist and an ingenious negotiator. She was married twice, each time to a brother. She waged a brutal civil war against the first and poisoned the second; incest and assassination were family specialties. She had children by Julius Caesar and Mark Antony, two of the most prominent Romans of the day. With Antony she would attempt to forge a new empire, in an alliance that spelled both their ends. Famous long before she was notorious, Cleopatra has gone down in history for all the wrong reasons. Her supple personality and the drama of her circumstances have been lost. In a masterly return to the classical sources, Stacy Schiff boldly separates fact from fiction to rescue the magnetic queen whose death ushered in a new world order.
    (http://www.amazon.ca/Cleopatra-A-Life-Stacy-Schiff/dp/0316001945)

    ReplyDelete
  10. Anyone seen the movie Divergent? Quite compelling. It's about a society with 6 distinct personality types that are NEVER allowed to mix. The most dangerous of the 6 is the divergents, who they try to discover and kill. It's interesting to see the overlap of all the personalities in the few hidden divergents. This would be a good topic for a future blog post on this site. I bet the various 'personalities' that visit this site would have a lot to say about it. So, if your looking for an interesting movie regarding this topic I'd recommend Divergent.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. will watch. thanks.

      Delete
    2. pretty good. took my kids. the book was better (read it bc one daughter was obsessed) but the basic concept is very interesting. I could see a sociopath/dauntless connection more than a sociopath/divergent connection, however, which may make the whole metaphor less compelling to this community.

      Delete
  11. katie. I have a sense your young. Are you young? I like your posts. You seem intelligent and willing to discuss what it's like for you to be a sociopath. Thank you for that. That's why I visit this site. To learn about sociopaths, personality disorders and human nature. There's a lot of intelligent posts on here from a variety of people with and without personality disorders. So my question for you Katie is do you ever have a desire to change/be better/do better. Do you think their will ever be any improvement in the relationships between sociopaths and others?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. i'm not katie, but being "better" is quite subjective. if you must kill 1 person to save 5, is it "better" than not killing that 1 and let 6 die?
      I'd like to think that once the level of ignorance in people lowers, everyone would be able to get along with everyone regardless of race, gender, social status, sexuality, and mental variant. a good first step would be to stop thinking of aspergers, aspd, etc as "disorders". No one should be deemed broken, some are just physically or mentally better suited for certain tasks and worse for others. Though of course it cannot be as simple as this, but making people feel bad about their issues tends to stop them from asking for help.

      Delete
    2. @Anon 3:30

      To turn things around, my question to you would be...

      Do you have a desire to change / be better / do better? I ask this question on the assumption that you (given the tone of your question) are not a sociopath), and therefore (again, given the tone of your question) think that you are morally superior to sociopaths.

      If I've completely misunderstood your post, please accept my apologies!

      Regards,

      <Zerothian

      Delete
    3. @anon 3:51

      Well said (better than I was able to).

      I've said on here previously - to paraphrase the "history is written by the victors" mantra: what is and is not a disorder will be defined (and therefore codified into current culture and thinking) by the majority.

      Therefore, the minority (in this case sociopaths) are "disordered" and must be cured or dealt with.

      Not so many years ago, the same rationale was being applied to homosexuals. Similar rationales were being applied to (for example) blacks and jews, with equally unpleasant results.

      <Zerothian

      Delete
    4. Only unpleasant when you're either a black or a yid.

      Which one are you?

      Delete
    5. @ 351 i agree. perfectly said.

      Delete
  12. I'm clearly not to good at explaining myself. I attempt to be my best self every day. I work very hard at that, at it's important to me.I had a shitty day today and wasn't my best self. I'm not trying to come across as superior to anyone(because I'm not. I consider us all equals.) I'm just wondering if you would even want to have a relationship that was satisfying for both parties? I feel like a hampster in a hampster wheel on here, just running in circles, making to progress. Didn't mean to offend anyone.

    ReplyDelete
  13. I saw the movie Frozen. That really is about sociopaths :P

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. oh gosh I thought I was crazy for thinking that! Glad someone else sees it that way

      Delete
    2. lol the author of this blog mentioned it before, and was watching it the other day. Made me laugh.

      Delete

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