Friday, November 15, 2013

Mistaken identities

I was visiting some friends over the weekend whom I hadn't seen in a while. I got picked up from the airport by one of them who had brought a health drink, saying, "I know that you only drink healthy things," when really I have a raging caffeine addiction and always have. After we fooled around a little, the same person remarked about how much gayer I seem and that I should just get over it and come out of the closet already. Later that evening when telling the story to another friend with her own self-interest in the subject, she argued that the fact that I could tell the happenings of the afternoon in such clinical detail indicated how not gay I seemed.

The next day I was at an invitation only party hosted by another friend. There was drama when someone uninvited showed up -- an ex of one of the guests. I asked if I should act as "enforcer," hockey style. My friend jokingly told me that I should and I nicely nicely showed the gentleman the door. When I came back, people were aghast that I had actually gone through with it, as if he were an innocent victim himself. I reminded the friend (who knows what I am) that I don't understand sarcasm, and you better be serious when you ask me to do something.

As I was taken back to the airport, I was talking to a different friend about my recent activities. She was amazed at how much I have been able to accomplish since I last saw her. In her words, I went from "fuck up" to "legitimate player." I shrugged at this because I didn't ever think I was ever so low as a "fuck up," nor am I successful enough now to be a "legitimate player."

I was amazed at how poorly all of my friends knew me. Perhaps they were projecting, misremembering, or making very inaccurate small talk, or maybe I used to be a different person around them.

I know this must happen to everyone -- to go back to a place you used to know and realize that you have since become someone different. But it still amazes me how much people will take every piece of information they learn about you, and somehow cram it to fit their own preconceived notions about you. People's knee jerk reaction is to cram a square peg into a round hole, for whatever reason.

Some of the readers here wonder how they weren't able to recognize the sociopaths in their lives for what they are. Part of it is the sociopath wearing masks, but mostly he doesn't have to try hard at all -- all of the work is being done for him.

150 comments:

  1. Mabey that happens on both sides. When you first meet someone how you see yourself in someone elses eyes is more exciting. As you get to know them it's and things wind down or change you keep returning to the intitial interactions to try and get back what started the attraction because it looked so much more promising.
    We all want to be ourselves around other's.
    Letting someone else be who they are is where you find what relationships are worth it but only if you are able to be accepted back for the real you.
    That's why I can understand the poit of wearing masks. At least a complete mask because it all started on a faulse unrealistic foundation.
    No one can keep that up forever. Your both hidding the real you.

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    1. So true. In the beginning of a relationship your both putting your best foot forward. It takes time to really get to know someone. I'd say at least a couple years.

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  2. Sorry writting on phone. Should be,
    Can't understand the plot of wearing masks.

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  3. Of course other people do most of the work in constructing the mask. Nobody wants to believe that a person without conscience, empathy and incapable of remorse could exist, so they simply assume that sociopaths are normal, and project human qualities onto them where they seem to be missing.

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    1. Thanks for this reality check, it is really hard to grasp and understand.

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  4. This type of behavior is not reserved only for sociopaths. People are projecting and have preconceived notions about every other human being. Empaths and sociopaths.
    I am a short of an empath, lesbian, etc etc and i can see clearly that my friends, my family, my colleagues are misinterpreting me all the time. I mean all the time.
    It's so obvious that all of us want to fit the other person in a box. We are happy labeling and putting in a nice order our contacts.

    You also do it all the time. You wrote many many articles about how you gather information about someone so you mold his/hers profile and predict their future behavior as they are some sort of an exhibit in a museum that can be studied and labelled. Once you made up your mind what the other person is you start "translate" him based on your assessment. BUT this is just YOUR assessment.
    She thought that you were a fuck up once. You thought maybe that she was a passive aggressive once or something.

    So it's not about empaths doing that for sociopaths or the other way around. It's everybody for everybody.

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  5. So hard to grasp. I'm always trying to figure out how to make things right again like they were in the beginning.

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  6. Are you talking about your relationship with that guy who chokes you during sex Wish I Knew. Are you still with him?

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  7. I wanted to believe that he was for real. And when I discovered he wasn't for real I wanted to assist him in changing(I wanted him to change). When that didn't work. I communicated to him I could accept him how he was and that it was ok. As long as from that point on he didn't lie I could handle him. But in fact,I wasn't being real, I needed to change and I needed to accept myself as a naive fool. It's all easy in the begining but after while I would resent him. Yes..I made it very easy for him to lie and be fake and if I understood him from the begining, and myself, we would be friends today.

    Grace

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    1. Even though I understand my friend now, it still couldn't work, because she can't control her 'impulses'. She can go long,long periods with appearing normal,but eventually she'll do something crazy! I would love to still be friends with her, I just can't take the backlash when it happens.

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  8. He has layed his forearm across my throat in a threat to chock me. He wants total submission. He started smacking my face but I stopped him. He wants to have me fight him but I haven't I'm scared of what it will turn into,He's told me he has no respect for me and will never care. I see him as little as possible now and try to make it public.
    He doesn't allow much talk besides talking dirty so the relationship has turned only sexual. Big change for when I met him a year and half ago.

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  9. M.E. said, "Some of the readers here wonder how they weren't able to recognize the sociopaths in their lives for what they are."

    Speaking for myself, until a few months ago, I had not known what Sociopathy was. I had heard the word but had never learned anything about it.
    I'm not sure the general public is aware of what Sociopathy is. Think of it like one of those physical disorders you've maybe heard of but don't have a reason to be educated on until you or someone you know is stricken with it.

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  10. wishiknew, why do you see him at all? are you hoping he will change or afraid to end it?

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  11. I didn't realize what he was and I don't think he does. I did after 10 months and only after many cruel but very honst things he said.
    I just don't know where I stand with him or what his purpose is for me.

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  12. what is your purpose for you? that's what's important.

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  13. Speaking of masks, couldn't a said NT's insecurities and ulterior motives be labeled as a mask as well?

    It often seems as if the basis of defensive thinking that I've gathered stems from the notion that everyone is so forthcoming with themselves except the person blamed for creating the deception, if indeed one truly believes deception was required in the first place.

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  14. anonymous, what you're saying is that we all wear masks. is that right?

    "Some of the readers here wonder how they weren't able to recognize the sociopaths in their lives for what they are. Part of it is the sociopath wearing masks, but mostly he doesn't have to try hard at all -- all of the work is being done for him."

    it's human nature isn't it to see what we want to see, to see only what fits into our map of reality?

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  15. Yes. I am saying that most everyone is guilty of having a mask and wearing it at some point or another. This is regardless of motive. Masks are not unique to necessity.

    As for human nature, I'm not qualified to answer. I would say "natures" would be the proper context and argue that there are plenty of realities to go around.

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  16. Our map of reality? Or our fantasy?
    Charming, good listener, always complimenting. Guess they feed our ego as we feed their's.
    Can't say I'm worse off for it. never knew it existed really (sociopathy) in the form of a human god. I did in the form of a bloodsuker in a freind's life and took whatever they could from other's so they didn't have to work, he seemed obvious to me. no mask at all.
    But.... Zoe, I feel like all the color has left my life when he's out of it.

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    1. You can get over that. In time, you'll put the color back in your life, and it will be brighter than ever! It's hard in the beginning when your missing some-one, but your responsible for the color and quality of your own life.

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  17. Good point about the bloodsucker, but I would also argue that it does not take a sociopath to be such. That or maybe society's doctors should broaden the definion and required criteria for a diagnosis and then attempt to view everyone through their masks, and hopefully not forget to look in the mirror when they're done :)

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  18. True, I'm limiting my personal experience to these two indivisual's.

    They were quite different from one another.

    Just want to thank the one's on this site for being opened with me.

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  19. Interesting. It seems like your blog has changed more towards your personal life. More specifically, it's recently been about you coming out of the closet to some people. It's nice to see you're not rehashing the same stuff over and over, M.E.

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  20. The comment about sarcasm is interesting, I'm always being told that everything I say is satire, yet I am never quite sure if I am being sarcastic or serious. I guess people I don't like to lie to would hope that the brutal honesty is merely humorous satire. The same goes for me when someone says something sarcastic I take it literally, it can be quite confusing.

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  21. Some other me
    so it is true that sociopaths have a hard time with sarcasm? as an uber empath, i use sarcasm all the time, usually for a really funny reason: for example, when i'm asked if i like someone and i actually really hate them, i simply can't handle emotionally recalling how much i hate them in that instant cos it would just make me feel bad, so to stave off the bad feeling i reply sarcastically but passionately that 'I Love them more than anything in the world!!' this is how i use sarcasm a heck of a lot and i swear to god there are numerous times when i'm being so ultra sarcastic and yet people think i'm being ultra sincere. i then have to explain that i'm being sarcastic. i use it when i'm trying to diffuse an inruding, unwanted emotion.
    basically cos i'm intense (borderline BPD) i generally either love or hate things, and when normal people see me expressing a genuine love for something, it seems so overblown to them that they always, always think i'm being sarcastic. it's twisted and upside-down and a pain in the arse quite frankly. so when i AM being sarcastic, they think it's sincere.
    i just can't win. sarcasm is a funny thing for many people. i met a socio and i could swear that he didn't get my sarcasm, which made for ridiculous stoccato-like exchanges where we just ended up echoing each other's lines. not only socios mirror you know! i'm pretty nifty at that myself.

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  22. Bipolar or Borderline?

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  23. borderline. not the extreme end. my therapist tried to stop me calling myself one, but i have enough of the traits, just not all.
    i don't like it. i'm just an uber empath really. the other stuff is just, well, shall we say, incidental?

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  24. i know this is off topic but what do the sociopaths here make of the topic of organised religion?
    from what i can see, religion is designed for sociopaths, and only sociopaths. religion does a disservice to those empaths who already have an over abundence of conscience.
    i'm an atheist/humanist. just wanted to know a socios take on it. (besides ME cos i know he did a post on compensating sociopaths).
    Are all religious socios bluffing?i know you can't speak for all socios, but what's your take on it?
    i have a socio in the family and he is staunchly ritualistic with his religion. he is NOT an empath and yet it's like he holds onto it more strictly than anyone else. he's sensitive (or maybe i am) about it too and so we don't discuss religion as he knows i'm an atheist and it just gets personal. to be honest it annoys me cos it's all so damn hypocritical. he picks and chooses from the doctrine how he likes. this is a big thing with me, i need intellectual honesty and clarity. i find that way of life so schizophrenic and it totally testifies to how socios and even normals can easily compartmentalise their cognition when i cannot. i'm compelled towards peace of mind and i find this difference so vast.

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  25. of course, i'm not gonna go all long-winded cos i could write a bleeding book on it, but the presence of religion disturbs me to no-end. organised religion is crude, utterly, so crude it's insulting to those with any human sensibility whatsoever.
    if sociopaths have the power, and religion is used by the powerful, then i do wonder what sociopaths have to say on the matter.

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  26. I view atheism as dogmatic as religion. I do not view either as good or bad. I enjoy listening to people argue over creation and science.

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  27. I wonder how many ministers might be sociopaths and not believe a word that comes out of their own mouths.

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  28. @Aerianne: I think the real question is, how many ministers are there that don't believe a word they are saying and aren't sure why.

    In regards to Atheism, it, in my opinion is it's own religion. The Anti-Religion. Atheism is just as arrogant and disillusioned as any old religion. Agnosticism is something I understand, in that, I don't know, nor am I stupid enough to think that I do, let alone press my ideas or beliefs on others with no real proof. Modern Atheism is more akin to the Anti-Christian Church, not the Anti-Religion community that they claim to be. Most Atheist literature that is spouted are contradictions to the Christian/Catholic church, not paying much of any attention to other religions. It's sad, really.

    Religion for a Sociopath is a funny thing, speaking of Christianity/Catholicism, and other beliefs akin. Redemption from your wrong-doings is a very common theme, as is the measure of your heart. I sociopath can ask for forgiveness but cannot be truly sorry in virtually all cases. This excludes the big C religion and a few others. Mind you, if you want for some reason, you could follow their moral code, praise their God, and try to be a good person, but you can't let go or something you don't have.

    In regards to Sarcasm: I had a really difficult time with sarcasm for a good chunk of my life. Then I had a roommate who was Always sarcastic, even when their was little reason for application. I admit, I'm not perfectly fluent with it, but I'm usually pretty good at both catching it and utilizing it. Like any social behavior, we can learn and attempt it with practice and study.

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  29. Notable, I suppose I just thought of ministers who are uncovered doing everything except what they preach and how those ministers seem to play on other's weaknesses and emotions to manipulate them. It just seemed likely that some of them could be sociopaths.

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  30. 'In regards to Atheism, it, in my opinion is it's own religion. The Anti-Religion. Atheism is just as arrogant and disillusioned as any old religion.'

    saying your an atheist is just simply stating you don't subscribe to any existing, solid religious code. arguing that a stance is anti-religion or anti- whatever doesn't automatically devalidate the position. although i get the agnosticism and the difference is mere semantics. i can't disprove a god anymore than i can disprove any immaterial thing. in all honestly, i'm pretty much a nihilist, philosophically speaking. only pragmatically that doesn't really help to engender direction, and the reality is that whether you are a sociopath or its direct opposite, the extreme empath, we all need a sense of motivation. as an empath, i lean towards a general humanism out of the compulsion of my nature - however that plays out on any given day. is this a choice. no. is it your choice that you are a socio? er, no.

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  31. would i die for humanism? lol. no. would i die for a specific human, possibly, but not in some deluded illusion that i'm protecting a grand ideology. i nurture peace, and harmony and encourage it where i see violence and chaos, but i understand the futility when there will always be people like you lot around. i do what i can and accept it's all an endless merry-go-round of mainly merryless comedy. i saw something where this guy said that even peace is war. it's just that the peace-lovers want to laud it over the war-mongerers and vice-versa. i never saw it like that before. funny ol world.

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  32. @Aerianne: I figured that was what you meant, but I was attempting to be somewhat thought provoking.

    Interesting anecdote regarding your query: A had a house-mate once that told me he had only met one person that ever proclaimed they were a Satanist (of the La Vey flavor) and he happened to be a youth pastor for a Baptist church. I chuckled.

    @Anon: Another dance with semantics here, but very definition of Atheism is the broad rejection of the belief in the existence of deities. I think what you actually subscribe to is what is sometimes called Skeptical Agnosticism, which is on the opposite spectrum from those folks who like to say, "I believe in God, I'm just not sure how it is spelled."

    It is somewhat entertaining that you mention philosophy and nihilism as an empath. I had my 'existential crisis', sans the actual crisis part. It was more of a, "Well shoot, what the **** am I supposed to do, now?" Being inherently selfish, thankfully ended this episode in my life fairly quick.

    I'm not against Nihilism, but simply feel that it carries a lot of negative connotation is the USA. It's a dirty word here, like Anarchist, often heard and rarely understood. I simply find that something's worth and meaning in life is defined by how I view it, not a pre-conceived and mandatory definition. I think a lot of Sociopaths can understand this view of life, as we often value people, ideas and objects based off on how we perceive them, not others. Being an existential nihilist and sociopath sounds dreadfully boring.

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  33. Notable, I don't think it's the same guy, but one of the Satanists that I know is a former Baptist youth minister, and he was both at the same time for a while. It's a small world.

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  34. Intriguing. Both possibilites have set my mind ablaze if this is in case the fact.

    1. It is the same person. Very odd that we would both know of him in this capacity.

    2. Baptist children have been infiltrated by a trickster group of well hidden Satanists, reveling in their games and subtle corruption.

    I probably shouldn't be smiling at either prospect. xD

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  35. I didn't recognize my sociopath because he wasn't mean, ever. And his odd little sociopath qualities came off as just quirkiness. I associate with mostly creative types, so his obsessive pop-culture references, coy misdirections (self-labeled as him "being cute" or "entertaining himself"), youthful arrests and calculated sizing up of new people just seemed a LOT LESS odd than a lot of the people I know. He drank too much but stayed away from drugs. He'd worked a million unskilled jobs, but kept the one he has now for over 5 years and is an operations manager. He was molested by his brother when he was a kid, but seemed to have dealt with it....He'd had 2 failed marriages but was the consummate romantic, he'd declared bankruptcy in the past, but had gotten rid of all credit cards....

    What the hell? I didn't know the specifics of less extreme sociopathy, just the stuff about cutting up animals when a child and hardened criminals with an obvious lack of remorse. I just assumed he'd had a rough childhood, a wild past and had since grown up. He will be 40 soon and seemed to have a very good handle on life.

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  36. He sounds similar to me, though I stopped myself from over-indulging in booze. I've never been addicted to any substance(not even cigarettes, which I have on occasion) but booze can be quite nice, especially when having a job you despise.

    I can only imagine a sociopath in a 12 step program. So much inner-commentary humor and angst against others.

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  37. your grasp on semantics is probably better than mine. i'll put it this way, first, we must define 'god.' if the definition is that of the existing religions then i would happily say that i would hate the premise of that sadistic, maniacal god so much that i wouldn't give a crap if i bowed down to its will or not.
    anyway, went off topic.

    'I simply find that something's worth and meaning in life is defined by how I view it, not a pre-conceived and mandatory definition. I think a lot of Sociopaths can understand this view of life, as we often value people, ideas and objects based off on how we perceive them, not others. Being an existential nihilist and sociopath sounds dreadfully boring.'

    lol at the last line there.

    well i have the same view. i call it being without an axis. grounding myself in a traditional, expected role does not come easy and i would have to force myself to do it. i call that 'pretending to be a grown up' but i swear that much like sociopaths are stuck at a certain level of development, i am too.

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  38. Honestly? I think he was trying to have a normal relationship. He really didn't understand compromise, though, especially for little things.....I'd say "OH! I really like this apartment" him,"I don't like wood floors". "It's a great place and the price is the best we can get. i'll buy a rug." "I don't like the look of wood". "Um.....okayyy, so do we have to do everything the way you prefer it?" Him(possibly realizing he was about to blow his cover?) "What!? No!? Of course not!" But he'd notice anything out of place. He called me in a panic (we lived in different cities and I kept a full wardrobe, shoes and personal effects there) when my toothbrush was missing. He tried to sound casual about it, but he didn't understand how so many things I did were not *significant* they were just the actions of a more careless and uncalculating person.....(I realize now)

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  39. My ex is a serious 12-stepper. 10 years hardcore junkie, though 10 years clean.

    I think the program keeps him stuck in the past and keeps him from gaining real success. I don't think the program helps his self-pity problem at all. He's over 40 but still stuck in the mind he had when he first shot up.

    (And he does indeed get off on lambasting others in private.)

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    1. I've seen 12 step programs, meditation, yoga, help sociopaths, just as it helps alcoholics, drug-abusers, over-eaters, etc. You have to find good meetings, there are some really bad ones!

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  40. Notable, The members of The Church of Satan are harmless toward children and animals, under their Eleven Satanic Rules Of The Earth.

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  41. Aerianne- If they are following the dogma as poorly as many other so-called devout folks..... Who knows what they were doing. Didn't they boot Michael Aquino from his executive position and excommunicate him for some questionable acts with minors? Not only Catholic priests are guilty of such things, I'm sure.

    Medusa- He was terribly good at a witty tear-down of others and appreciated when I called a batty cougar "the Cryptkeeper" and a not-quite-attractive overblown, overdone look-at-me-I'm-a-model-AND-i-play-dungeon-and-dragons gal "Bride of Chucky". He seemed so terribly entertained by me in my cattiest moments. I just thought I could do no wrong in his eyes.

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  42. Medusa, I also think that the 12 Step Program attendance could outlive it's usefulness in a person's life.

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  43. Sadly, Amelia, what I said was a bit tongue-in-cheek.
    Everyday, my faith in the human animal's propensity to lie grows. I trust no one and believe no vows or oaths that anyone makes.

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  44. Aerianne- I couldn't agree more with you about 12-stepping. For some it turns into years of dwelling on the worst time of their life, it seems.

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  45. Medusa, I also think that the 12 Step Program attendance could outlive it's usefulness in a person's life

    Aerianne- I couldn't agree more with you about 12-stepping. For some it turns into years of dwelling on the worst time of their life, it seems.

    Absolutely. Especially since it doesn't deal with psychological realities (which he refuses to do) that got him there in the first place. It becomes a security blanket.

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  46. @Amelia: Taken completely out of context, I doubt it was so much, "shoot i'm about to blow my cover" as it probably was, "crap, that wasn't how I'm supposed to act, apparently"

    @Aerianne: I did not mean to describe him as a member of the specific Church of Satan, as there are many splinters of the La Vey flavor. I also am not sure he actually was trying to corrupt anyone. He certainly got off on the fact of his position and secret, though.

    I cannot speak for or against 12 step programs, only that it has worked wonders for some and has been completely useless for others. I think getting over addiction is similar to education, in that each person has their optimal way of progressing, and a 12 step may not be the best for all.

    Trying to digress to the topic at hand, and also in reply to Amelia, it sounds like your man was simply caught in a moment where his own charm and your projections were not enough, and he had seen that sort of reaction before, and knew he had to remedy it fast of face the consequences of 'What is wrong with you?' A question I think a lot of us wish we could answer without consequence.

    @Anon: God (in that sense) sounds an awful lot like a sociopath.

    HA

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  47. I also think he sticks with it because it makes him feel powerful and important. The younger ones in recovery, and those with less years of sobriety look up to him as a father figure, as it's rare to have someone with that many years clean in the program.

    It is there that he can feel like a "success", I guess.

    Sorry, I guess I hijacked the atheism discussion.

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    1. That seems like progress to have ten years off the needle, and other addicts looking up to you.

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  49. Amelia said, "He was terribly good at a witty tear-down of others and appreciated when I called a batty cougar "the Cryptkeeper" and a not-quite-attractive overblown, overdone look-at-me-I'm-a-model-AND-i-play-dungeon-and-dragons gal "Bride of Chucky". He seemed so terribly entertained by me in my cattiest moments."
    Sigh...Reminds me of myself and my estranged socio. Shame I had to end it.

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  50. My favorite was the comments he made about throwing hot dogs at the ice skater's crotches while we were watching the Olympics.

    Miss that guy. He's three blocks away from me right now. Every Tuesday. I always feel uncomfortable on Tuesdays.

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  51. the notable path

    ha yeah i didn't miss that one. :D


    battered spouse syndrome - 'oh but he loves me really!'

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  52. "Lovefraud". There, I said it before anyone else did :P

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  53. Haha Aerianne!

    This is totally one of those nights. Especially since the dudes don't seem to be around. It's like the party when the parents are away.

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  54. @Notable: I'm a nihilist and an anarchist, as it happens. I don't find it boring at all.

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  55. Oh, us 'dudes' are around, at least, this one...

    It's just, I've had to look back on all my serious relationships pre-realization of my condition, to reflect on how I was usually the main reason they ended, not because of being dumped, but because I lost the luster and desire to maintain them and ultimately left. I'm currently dating someone, and for once, I haven't done your classic sociopath schtick. No data-mining, not much of any compromise of existing character, not even appreciating crappy music for the sake of making her feel better. I've just been trying to 'be me', and only fake emotions and do my damnedest to not lie. I'm not especially fond of her (just enough), but I think I make her happy, and seeing her happy makes me happy (I think).

    Not to mention, she's highly intelligent. I'm not used to having such intellectually stimulating conversations with a love interest :P Quite refreshing.

    I'll say it once, and I'll say it again. There's always the chance that your Ex doesn't know what's wrong with them. Telling them, when they don't know, only empowers them to act in a sociopath fashion, and no longer hold the veil or courtesy of being apologetic.

    /Sigh

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  56. @Postmodern Sociopath: But are you a true existential nihilist? Something tell me not quite, if you feel inclined to even align yourself with a political viewpoint.

    I don't have anything against anarchists or feel that they would be a boring lot. I was mentioning that the both of them generally are held in ill regard in the States.

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  58. Very true, about the perception in the US.

    As for my own sort of nihilism, I wouldn't say I'm limited to existential nihilism. It certainly describes a part of my feelings on existence, but in equal measure I am also a metaphysical nihilist and an epistemological nihilist, as definitions go.

    I say that I am an anarchist for simplicity's sake. Technically, I am an egoist, which you may find jives a bit more easily with the nihilist mindset. I certainly don't align myself with any parties or viewpoints beyond my own self-interest. I actually find most "anarchists" supremely distasteful.

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  59. Anarchy in America = an excuse to be lazy, not shower, have a stupid haircut, beg for change instead of getting a job, steal stuff not out of principal or higher self-interest but because you want free beer, and sew black patches with quasi-post-apocalyptic messages onto your bags and jackets.

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  61. Exactly, Medusa. Those are the sorts that piss me off. I don't spend everyday getting high, navel-gazing, and bitching about "the system". I carve out my little chunk the way I do because it fucking works for me. You should see the looks I get from "nice" anarchists. You'd think I was Karl Rove or some shit. No, assholes, I break the law because it works, not because it's "meaningful" or a "protest".

    I do like a good Black Bloc, though. :D

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  62. There's basically three types of stereotypical anarchists that I've seen in the States.

    1. The Primal Anarchists, ie, self-worshiping farmers

    2. Aforementioned (in your posts) worthless piles of shit

    3. 'Goodly Anarchists', usually in love with the idea but wouldn't lift a finger, let alone a rifle, for its sake

    I'm sure there are others, but those are the ones I have observed.

    After reading into what an Egoist is, I'd be inclined to agree with such a philosophy for many issues. However, like anarchy, practical application is null in the States. It sure sounds enticing on paper, though.

    I think, for the sake of humor, the next time someone asks me my political affiliation, I'll pull out a cig (Natural American Spirit, Yellow Box, Light filter), light up, and say, "Goddamn, I love this country. How 'bout you?" *long drag*

    The only thing Americans seem to hate more than terrorists, child molesters and serial killers, happen to be smug, egotistical, wiseass smokers.

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  63. Null in the legal parts of the States, surely. It's a decent philosophy in the less reputable parts, though. I don't push it on people, unlike most anarchists. As far as I'm concerned, the fewer self-assured, rationally self-interested people there are, the easier it is to control my territory.

    Ick. You smoke the lights? I only go for the Blues, Organics, Menthols, and Periques... so, anything that isn't a light.

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  64. The only ones I've tried thus far. Used to smoke Marbs back in the day, but when I started again I decided to give them a shot and like them more.

    What are the Periques/Organics like? I'm tempted to give them a try.

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  65. Buy an electric cigarette rolling machine and roll your own. I do. Smoking costs me $10 a week and I haven't been sick in the almost 2 years that I've been off the store bought cigarettes.

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  66. I currently smoke the Yellow Spirits as well.

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  67. If I'm going to roll, I do it by hand, thank you. :P

    Bali Shag all the way.

    Notable: They'll be notably harsher than you're used to, probably. I prefer them, but I hate lights. I'm not exactly unbiased.

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  68. Light's don't bug me one bit. I was smoking cigars left and right before I realized it was getting too expensive every time I get a nicotine hankering.

    Typically I have one-three a day, depending on if I'm working, and the weather. Today was four, blah. NAS, thankfully, usually packs enough punch for me to only want one in the space of several hours.

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  69. Yep. I can only smoke 1/3 of one of those cigarettes at a time.

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  70. Has anyone tried Malboro brightleaf?

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  71. Good work Noble Path. Unfortunately I do not mean your Zen lol, but your finding respectable intellect in another.

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  72. wish i knew said...
    But.... Zoe, I feel like all the color has left my life when he's out of it.


    i know, i've been there, when i was younger. then what i realized one day was that the feelings, the need, were a kind of mental mind game i was playing. the feelings had nothing to do with him. he was in fact replaceable, and just filling a void. he was only a distraction that kept me from having to look too closely into my own life.

    missing him is one thing, but feeling like he is the only thing that brings colour into your life is entirely another. this will seem harsh, but reverse it... would you want to be with someone who is nothing without you?

    when i was seventeen or eighteen i was at a party at a friend's house. late in the evening, when everyone was sitting around or passed out, i overheard a conversation between two other girls, as i made my way to the bathroom. one was holding up a set of keys, very importantly, as if they were something very valuable in her possession, and jingling them. they were her boyfriend's keys, and there were a great many of them, and to my (rather drunken) amazement, she was very methodically and very proudly explaining what each one was for.

    so wishiknew, you have to ask yourself, do you want to be the kind of person who sits at a party and has nothing more interesting to share with another human being than her boyfriend's set of keys?

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  73. Another dance with semantics here, but very definition of Atheism is the broad rejection of the belief in the existence of deities.

    Actually no, most notable NotablePath. Atheism proper boils down to being without a belief in god, period. That is not the same thing as actively rejecting god, which would be anti-theism.

    Atheism is to religion what not being a stamp collector is to stamp collecting. Not being a stamp collector does not make you the same thing as a stamp collector only opposite. Not being a stamp collector does not mean you really are a collector in denial. The only thing it means is that you are not a stamp collector.

    Lastly, it does not follow that not collecting stamps makes one dogmatic, does it? If someone who doesn't collect stamps sounds harsh when talking about stamp collectors, it might be in response to being surrounded by millions and millions of said stamp collectors who bombard non stamp collectors with the message that stamp collecting is sacred and that those who disagree are BAD, BAD, Bad News Bears. The non stamp collector might get a wee bit annoyed after hearing that message for the millionth time, don't you think?

    I'm just sayin...

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  74. daniel birdick

    thanks for doing the spiel. was not feeling up to it but i'm glad you put it across.

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  75. I guess, to use Daniel's analogy, I'm an anti-philatelist. :D

    I actively reject belief in gods in the same way that I actively reject dogma, morality, reality, etc. I dislike "hard atheists" or whatever they call themselves now because they dogmatize their own disbelief and hold up science as their golden calf. I enjoy the logical structure of science, sure, and I'll use it to prove my points. But at the heart of it, I don't take it as any more "true" than anything else. It just has more entertaining explanations than "a wizard did it".

    Rather hilariously, atheists have lost their way. Should make a fine anti-parable for the Anti-Bible.

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  76. postmodern sociopath:

    on a general point,
    just cos you don't so much care about truth it doesn't mean it doesn't matter. sociopaths and everyone else (whether they appreciate it or not) rely on those who care about the fact that truth matters. i appreciate that for most, (esp socios) when it comes to truth, they can take it or leave it as long as their lives are moving along relatively smoothly. but it's dependent on those who DO care that when you (socios) or anyone is in a sticky situation, there may be some solution favourable on your side, since you would not want to be brushed aside as simply 'evil' right? whether you personally don't care about that does not mean others won't if it happens to them.
    and no i'm not off point, though it may seem so.

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  77. @PoMoSo

    But at the heart of it, I don't take it as any more "true" than anything else.

    You begin to feel tingling and numbness in various parts of your body, you inexplicably lose your balance at inopportune moments, you experience weakness in or more of your limbs and your vision blurs. You decide that it is prudent to find out what is going on with your body. Who do you go to for help, a licensed medical doctor or a local Wiccan teen girl across town?

    You decide to travel to Vancouver. You would like to get there as fast as you can. Do you buy a plane ticket or bus ticket or do you pull out your broom, Harry Potter style?

    Your computer malfunctions. Do you call a computer technician or a magic crystal technician?

    You get my point.

    Reason is the best epistemological tool mankind has for dependably figuring out how the world works. Reason gives rise to science and technology. Faith and irrationality have a deplorable track record in this regard. It just so happens that on balance, atheism seems to be an almost inevitable result of founding one’s worldview on reason.

    Reason (thus science and technology) works. You can call that dogmatic if you like. I call it pragmatic.

    Rather hilariously, atheists have lost their way.

    I have? To be lost must mean that I am somehow disoriented, unable to pinpoint my location in relation to where I should/want to be. From where I have lost my way, where should I be going and why?

    Damn philatelist!

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  78. The problem is that you assume there is actual, objective "truth", which I don't think is the case. Your use of the phrase "the fact that truth matters" reveals your assumption. By what logic do you contend that it is a fact. Even if you have a logical argument for the existence of truth or facts, prove to me then that your logical system is complete.

    Either your system is consistent, and therefore there are certain "truths" which are unprovable, or your system can prove all "truths", but it cannot prove its own validity and consistency.

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  79. "hard atheists" sometimes call themselves humanist. :)

    i agree with your comment, post, about no one belief being truer than another, but is it really possible to be an anti-philatelist (using daniel's analogy) when the mind only knows how to be a philatelist? your active rejection of belief in gods, dogma, morality etc. is in itself a dogmatic belief system. so, you'd have to also reject your rejection of beliefs.

    but then the rejection of your rejection of beliefs would become your belief, and so on. so how do you get away from beliefs?

    if rejection of a belief is the opposite of acceptance of its reality, couldn't you say that rejection is the acceptance of its unreality? and the acceptance of the reality of the belief is the rejection of its unreality? either way, you're subscribing to a belief. i don't see a way out.

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  80. Zoe said, either way, you're subscribing to a belief. i don't see a way out.

    Why would you want or need one?

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  81. Daniel: Doctor, plane, and no one because I can fix my own damn computer. I certainly agree that reason is the best tool we have, but it is inherently flawed (perception being what it is). There is no less flawed system, though, so I work within a rational perspective.

    I certainly wouldn't call proper affection for reason dogmatic. But suggesting that a constructed rational system is definitely descriptive of the universe is as unfalsifiable as God.

    I should have been more clear; I referred to atheists who pout about theists and talk about FSM endlessly, not your rational sort. The public face of atheism is unfortunately, not as reasonable as you are.

    Zoe: There's no way to explain myself that won't sound like a belief system. It is the curse of language, I suppose.

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  82. hey hey hey
    what is it with you stealing my thunder. ;)

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  83. Should be a comma just before that "unfortunately".

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  84. Addendum: Using the Oxford definition of dogmatic ("inclined to lay down principles as incontrovertibly true"), I would say that my thoughts on existence are not dogmatic in the least. I do not talk of these things as though they are incontrovertible facts because such a concept is in direct opposition to my position.

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  85. @Daniel:

    when you buy into a belief, by saying this is how the world is, you're also saying this is how it isn't. it's like putting on mental blinkers. reality becomes narrower.

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  86. postmodern sociopath

    'The problem is that you assume there is actual, objective "truth", which I don't think is the case. Your use of the phrase "the fact that truth matters" reveals your assumption'

    in my last comment i was tempted to say we should begin with a definition of truth, then i thought, for the reasons you stated, i'd rather not.

    'Zoe: There's no way to explain myself that won't sound like a belief system. It is the curse of language, I suppose'

    that's 'true.' best to stay silent i think. let's shut this blog down and be done with anything.

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  87. "best to stay silent i think. let's shut this blog down and be done with anything."

    Well, now you're just trying to make a Straw Nihilist out of me. Very rude, indeed. The denial of purpose or meaning isn't an insistence that one should just lay down and die. It's simply that no course of action is any more meaningful than any other. I choose to continue living and doing things because I have fun doing so. No moral obligation, no sense of wasted potential, no vague hope that I'll do something amazing... I just do what's fun for me.

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  88. zoe

    'when you buy into a belief, by saying this is how the world is, you're also saying this is how it isn't. it's like putting on mental blinkers'

    what's the alternative?

    reality is infinite, to stand straight with shrink it. (poetry, ain't it fine)

    the respect to REALITY actually limits this narrowing. it's our only hope against the most narrowing of dogmas out there.
    fight fire with fire. THERE IS NO ABSENCE.

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  89. @PoMoSo:

    But suggesting that a constructed rational system is definitely descriptive of the universe is as unfalsifiable as God.

    Which is why most scientific theories are always tentative statements on how the universe appears to work rather than closed conclusions. And yes, a lot of people on the secular side do seem to forget that sometimes.

    I won’t get into defending public atheist figures. Their work should stand or fall on its own merits. I jumped into this discussion about atheists because for one thing, that’s my current position on the god question and for another thing, there are a lot of misconceptions about this belief system, like NotablePath’s comparing atheism to religion, for instance. That one is a very common but misleading trope.

    @Zoe:

    True, but again, not only is there no choice, do we really want there to be? It seems to me that it’s to our advantage that we ‘narrow’ our view toward the way the world appears to actually work. Being perpetually open to any and every concept about the universe is an interesting way to live, that’s for sure. It can also get you killed if you aren’t careful. Which I think is echoing anonymous philosopher’s comment to you…

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  90. postmodern sociopath

    It's simply that no course of action is any more meaningful than any other

    i agree. meaning is meaningless anyway.

    maybe the word should be preferable, and yes that depends on perspective and no i have no solution to that conundrum. my brain needs a rest. i'm out of sorts.

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  91. "Which is why most scientific theories are always tentative statements on how the universe appears to work rather than closed conclusions."

    Which is exactly why subscribing to scientific rationality and subscribing to nihilism are not mutually exclusive. I'm glad, if nothing else, that you are not one of those screeching atheists that ruled over the Skeptics Club at my university.

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  92. i meant 'we' shrink it not 'with' in the poem.

    listen, all i mean is that it's about protection. i am not a sociopath, and so to me, by nature, can't help but conserve the rights of anyone who wants them. most dogmas out there are tribalistic and at worst idiotic. science does not give a damn about who it serves. as sociopaths, apart from daniel, i can see why you don't care so much.
    but you should, cos you're alive as opposed to being lynched for what you are.

    nothing matters out of context. nothing at all. it's about ensuring something is in place for when it does matter to you. and hence, it matters.'
    i am interested in what famous sociopaths, if any, you admire and for what reasons (what have they contributed to cultural change?). or is it not in your make-up to admire at all?

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  93. This comment has been removed by the author.

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  94. Why should I be lynched instead of any other individual? Because my brain chemistry (might) be different? Why not just lynch all the depressives and the aspies, too, then?

    "nothing matters out of context. nothing at all. it's about ensuring something is in place for when it does matter to you. and hence, it matters.'"

    What exactly are you trying to say? Are you suggesting that something will matter more to me at one point than at another? A hammer is useful to me when I need to hammer something, but does that make the hammer matter to me? No. It is a tool, nothing more. I could just as easily use a rock.

    Why should I admire anyone? I admire some viewpoints that people hold; I admire some actions that people take; and I admire strategy. Why should I admire a whole person? It suggests that there's something transcendent about the person, which is generally not the case. And why would I admire famous sociopaths? They're all famous for being caught and they contributed to your "let's lynch the sociopaths" mentality. What's to admire?

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  95. if you read my comments you'll see that i actually largely agree with you on the subject of truth. maybe there's been a misunderstanding.

    'Why should I be lynched instead of any other individual? Because my brain chemistry (might) be different? Why not just lynch
    all the depressives and the aspies, too, then?'

    i don't think you should be lynched which is precisely what i've been defending. but the fact you express an opinion on the matter kind of proves my point that it does indeed, matter to you.

    as for admiration, i mean it in the way you describe it and knew full well you'd respond the way you have.

    it's funny how when even people largely agree on something they still mange to disagree.
    i'll try to be more articulately anal with my sentences next time if that's what you like.

    bottom line is: some people are born idealists. you can't take that out of them. it has nothing to do with a lack of logical thinking. they are not mutually exclusive.
    you have demonstrated that as a socio who just wants to have fun, you need people who care about your rights.

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  96. Now you're just making up details and putting words in my mouth to support your a priori conclusions. Done with you. Have a nice day.

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  97. if you think i'm trying to goad you i'm not. it's not my style, certainly not in text.

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  98. To clarify, I did not express an opinion on my lynching. I asked by what logic I was, in your estimation, more worthy of lynching than any other individual.

    When did I suggest that idealism is exclusive to nonlogical thinkers? Or that it's a bad thing?

    I define my own rights, and I take them by the methods I find most effective. I don't "need" people to care about me; it's a convenience. What have I said which suggests otherwise?

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  99. Daniel said...
    True, but again, not only is there no choice, do we really want there to be? It seems to me that it’s to our advantage that we ‘narrow’ our view toward the way the world appears to actually work. Being perpetually open to any and every concept about the universe is an interesting way to live, that’s for sure. It can also get you killed if you aren’t careful. Which I think is echoing anonymous philosopher’s comment to you…


    the mind can only operate within belief systems and there is no way around that. at some point you have to at least believe in the basic stuff like that the sun will rise in the morning, that apples are food, that you will grow old...

    but you don't have to get attached or treat beliefs as if they are truths. maybe that's the answer?

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  100. Anonymous said...
    what's the alternative?


    awareness? beliefs make you lazy. you can just go around repeating the thoughts that subscribe to your belief and shut out everything else.

    Anonymous also said...
    reality is infinite, to stand straight with shrink it. (poetry, ain't it fine)

    the respect to REALITY actually limits this narrowing. it's our only hope against the most narrowing of dogmas out there.
    fight fire with fire. THERE IS NO ABSENCE.


    i didn't mean to imply we should live like nothing matters and nothing is real, just be aware that most of our truths are just beliefs. beliefs can be powerful. but respecting them doesn't mean i will let them take my mind hostage.

    actually, anon, i have no idea what you're trying to say. lol, sorry. daniel seems to have interpreted differently. but then your post is kinda like a text equivalent of a roscharch ink blot. pretty though.

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  101. @PoMoSo

    Ok, I’ll admit. Some on the secular/humanist/atheist side of the spectrum can be more ‘vocal’ than is absolutely necessary. Those types tend to take all of this very personal.

    @Zoe

    I define knowledge as justified beliefs. I define beliefs, in turn, as statements about the way reality works. These statements are then used to make predictions, consider likely outcomes and as guidance for action. Beliefs are justified to the degree that they track with evidence and are as logically coherent as possible. Knowledge (justified belief) counts as ‘truth’ for all practical purposes. I agree with PMS when he implies that perfect logical coherence is impossible (we must meet a contradiction and circular thinking at some point), but that impossibility does not in any way make reason itself impossible, nor does it hamper science, nor does it mean that all beliefs are equal and therefore interchangeable. Obviously.

    I said all that in response to the distinction you made between belief and truth. Unjustified belief would count as false. Attachment comes in when truths are made personal. That’s the main reason people get so fired up about god and religion. Believes about god are intensely personal precisely because they symbolize people’s ‘ultimate concerns’, as Tillich would put it.

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  102. Oh and you're right Zoe, I don't really have any idea what anonymous philosopher was getting at. Hence my tentative sounding sentence at the end.

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  103. "I define knowledge as justified beliefs. I define beliefs, in turn, as statements about the way reality works."

    Perfect, Daniel. That's really all I want from people. Justified belief. I'm not at all surprised by your definition, and I'm quite pleased by it.

    In case it wasn't clear, I don't mean to imply that reasoning about knowledge within the logical framework that we operate is impossible, simply that, as you stated, perfect logic is impossible. I certainly wouldn't say that all beliefs are equal and interchangeable in their validity (or soundness, depending on your definition of truth), but I do my best to avoid any monolithic belief structures. Having everything written for you in a book destroys the ability to think critically about your apparent knowledge, which in turn reduces your ability to alter your worldview in the presence of new data.

    In my case, if tomorrow there was an absolutely irrefutable proof of reality as we know it (what form it would take, I don't know), I would give up nihilism in that very moment. To cling to the old paradigm would be personally harmful, so I would abandon it. New information must necessarily change one's outlook. Even new data which supports an already widely held belief (the recent possible proof of P ≠ NP comes to mind) adds nuance and credibility to that belief.

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  104. its me again. i have no idea why you don't understand what i am saying. maybe cos i'm not a socio but an HSP (uber-empath, god that gets annoying to repeat).
    I agree entirely with daniel birdick and if that didn't come across then scuse me.

    i even largely agree with the rest too. it's silly how even when people largely agree, they still manage to disagree.

    postmodern sociopath

    regarding your last post to me,

    'To clarify, I did not express an opinion on my lynching. I asked by what logic I was, in your estimation more worthy of lynching than any other individual'

    by the logic that some would find any grounds on which to persecute others.

    you may define your own rights and guard them, but many are not able to protect theirs for a myriad of reasons.

    as for the fact that i may use the word idealism and stick it in amongst a discussion on the value of truth, i didn' know it would boggle your mind so much.

    if this comment leaves you all confused, then i can't help that.
    i can't keep reiterating cos you at some point you lost the thread.

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  105. zoe

    your post to me starting with

    'awareness?.....

    yes, i agree. that is what i was saying.

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  106. sorry postmodern sociopath

    i realised i just parroted a previous reply to you.

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  107. My mind wasn't boggled, Anon. I inferred from "bottom line is: some people are born idealists. you can't take that out of them. it has nothing to do with a lack of logical thinking. they are not mutually exclusive." that you had gotten something from my posts that I didn't intend, i.e., an opinion on idealism. If my inference was incorrect, that's my fault.

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  108. i'm chuckling only cos this is proof of how our brains work very differently. i'm not a logician by any means. i'm more on the artistic side of things and so i forego linearity quite happily, and possibly unwisely. maybe i should just leave...
    i'll go get me some fun. :D

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  109. I don't think it has anything to do with brains working differently, Anon. Just bad communication, and thinking you are all discussing the same thing when you are not.

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  110. ...and that was a general "you".

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  111. maybe. or it's the dope ;)

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  112. Anon 6:06 "it's silly how even when people largely agree, they still manage to disagree"

    Why is it silly? That's what makes it interesting. I think it's great to read these comments!! I don’t experience this kind of dialogue anywhere else.

    About truth: I have a problem with it… I can't decide what I "truly" believe in. God, or no God, reality or dream, meaning or no meaning. I feel like I can’t move forward until I get these questions situated in my head. I just do what I have to but it doesn't feel so satisfying like I thought it would..talking about school…and I’m bored with life. Even though I know I'm lucky with what's in my life. I wish I could take a stand on something and make it mine and roll with it but I can’t. Maybe I just can’t decide on who or what the f I am. I say to myself…there is a creator because what the hell else could it be? Then a few minutes later I think..well maybe it’s all just a dream..who’s I don’t know. By tonight I’ll be thinking…I’m the God in my life and there is no other. My intuition always gets stronger when I think of a creator, and evolution came into the picture down the road.

    Grace

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  113. grace.

    (not suggesting you do) but when people pray, they are praying to themselves. simple as. there is nothing else to discuss about the metaphysical.

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  114. I really would like to know what "predictions" people who read this
    blog have for M.E. Do you think she will be happy in the future?
    Or, do you think she will overstep like sociopaths often do?
    Seeing what I do about her, I think she will live a long and healthy
    life, as long as she can avoid being in the wrong place at the wrong
    time.
    Why should I even care? Because, it is no benefit to me to see
    ANYONE suffer. Jealousy, holds no advantages for me. What's good
    for one, is good for all. A healthy happy M.E. is much better then an
    enraged, miserible M.E. A person of her intelligence could REALLY
    to either benificial or harmful things to society. I want her to do
    helpful things.

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  115. A common experience for many that I've had is that people remember you through the filter of their life experience. You may've grown, and they may've grown, but emotional prejudices that are related to old pain can be difficult to shake. There's also the common experience of going home (or visiting family of origin) and being treated like you're a teenager (or even a child).
    People acquire mental maps and some personalities have little interest in updating them if you do not appear to offer them something that they want. They are happy to keep you a two dimension bit player in the drama of their lives. Irritating? Perhaps- but also a gift in that if someone treats you this way it's a pretty good indicator that they are too self focused to interact with the actual you. We all have limited energy and sometimes it's best to "cut your losses" and relate in a similarly superficial (and hopefully brief) way with these individuals.

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  116. Do people here who have identity problems and also splitting also feel like their notions and sentiments and beliefs in nihilism are gastly different tham their insistance yhat all their actions and notions about their actions actially serve them as a giide fo
    "proper"behaviour, or behaviour that will GETthe best results.

    I have this dillema almost every day. I search to find just exavtlly whatt it is thayt matters...the choices... I cannot decide what isright for me.


    I wonder, do the other people who were raised by narcissistic parents who jerked around their kids and gave double messages,like mine did, also ecperience this split in the way they think. I strugglle with identity problems..obviously.

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    Replies
    1. Continued..

      So I am kind of depressed abt it..and I just looked up "depression and nihilism"

      I think this blog is getting me more depressed.
      And I wonder if the people who read here get depressed, or if the people who used to comment also got depressed.

      Thank you for reading. I would appreciate any kind of feedback.

      Delete
    2. In addition to the last sentence of my first post...or make them feel like better people

      See, I dont really want to struggle with wanting or needing to be a better person anymore because it hinders me.

      Delete
    3. "better" is a subjective term. Whose version of "better" is the right one?

      Learn yourself- what triggers you to act in a way that you logically understand to be dysfunctional. Try to see why that behavior developed and then evaluate whether it still serves a purpose. If not- then you get to decide what "better" looks like. The internal conflict you reference "hinders" you. So to feel better- what beliefs must you release/relearn so you can approach situations without getting stuck in ambivalence that leads to inaction?

      After you know what your "triggers" are (for many people it is interacting with family of origin during the holidays), then you can identify them as targets for change. The way that works is- it's not right or wrong to go home for the holidays on a moral level (even if many people suggest otherwise). The real issue is: does it help you be the person you want to be? The way this situation plays out practically is- can you be in that situation without wanting to light everyone on fire or do other malevolent things? Then go... If that is an insurmountable challenge you act in everyone's best interest by avoiding the situation until you can be less vulnerable to emotional "triggers".

      Delete
    4. It makes me horribly "sad" to read things on here. Sad about, not ME for example, but human nature.

      Delete
    5. I think that there is a lot of sadness inherent in discovering the dark side of human nature. Ignorance is bliss (or so they say). But I think that if you can bear looking at the darkness within yourself (and others you regularly cross paths with) then you are able to make better long term decisions about how you allocate your emotional and physical resources.

      Understanding darkness helps you appreciate light and not take it for granted. Understanding darkness does not mean giving yourself over to it, but anticipating its dangers instead of walking blindly into certain traps. It's human nature to want to avoid pain, and confronting evil can be very scary and painful/depressing.
      I find myself on this blog to confront by my own demons and those from my past. To see that there is a sort of logic/pattern to certain types of dysfunctional behavior has been enormously helpful in learning to sidestep those dangers in real life. This blog is a gift for those of us seeking to understand how the sociopathic mind works because it is very different (and not altogether bad). Understanding aids future interactions.

      Delete
    6. "Understanding aids future interactions."

      So true. I'll tread much more carefully now.

      Delete
    7. Hi machemp. Thank you for the suggestions abt triggers. I dont really act out too much, as I am yood at predicting what may happen and how things may pan out 6 mos down the road, say.

      What I have problems with is effeciency because my thoughta are the triggers and sometimes I spend lots of energy trying to feel what it is I feel without arguing either why I do or ro not feel a certain way . Situations come up where I get paralyzed bec of this, then I either dwell on the nondecision of how I feel, or just bag the decision altogether.

      Then after that, I feel just plain bad, like I am useless to kyself, that I am just ono one, without efficient use of my environment.

      Thes3 5h7ngs come up more when I qm depreas3d 5han not, and unfortunately these 5hings pile onto existing depression. Inefficiency brings me eown hut also serves as acdistraction from th8ngs imshould be doing,

      Thinking abt the things I should be doing or should not be doing are really the triggers. Really, I think I am obsessional thinker paralyzed. Thoughrs are self destructive. I have tried affirmation stuff and I end up laughing like oh yeah thats going to help.

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    8. I think I want to start my hrain over like how one cleans a computer...start fresh. Do wish that I was not trained to think unpleasant things abt myself..you know, the lies.
      In the long run, I want to be able to overcome them. I feel ....well like what the fuck is the point. So try to suppress those thoughrs and feelings bec when I feel them I dont stop crying. I never stop crying. Then with pther people it is happy charming again, focus on them .
      Do not like to be by myself in own thoughts.
      Its my brain.

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    9. My brain is self destructive to me. I think it would prob be a good idea to look at the way others impact my feelings. Because I have a habit of taking my responsibilities of my feelihgs all by myself. I dont view other peoples actions as reason enough for me to feel things. So inam disconnected from peoples impact, and yet deep down I know on some lev3l I ignore th3m for some self preservation I guess. I dont like to feel unpleasantness from others. I give myself enough unpleasantness. It doesnt make any sense that they are the dause. So I own my own feelings too much and live in a vacuum. Then inget pissed lol. And irs hard for me to backtrack to a trigger.

      I looked at "thought supression" and borderline . I think I have q bit of that.

      Sorry, I hope that I am not dumping.

      Barely anyone gets this. Thank you so much for being kind enough to help me sort out what problems are,
      I will work on the t4iggers which make me suppress my thoughts, as I think that may be a tood place to start :)

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    10. This may sound like an oversimplified solution- but sometimes intense physical exercise can take the edge off of overwhelming emotions once you have already been triggered. If you can interrupt a cycle of overreaction there's far less interpersonal damage to clean up dow the road.

      I'm not borderline, but have dealt with a major depression in college and battled suicidal feelings (didn't act) related to my triggers. Thought suppression was not helpful to me at all. So my advice may or may not be helpful. But if you're willing to put on a pair of running shoes and take your rage out on hill repeats you will be rewarded by euphoria (and great legs if you make it a regular habit). Running (did marathons for a while before knee injuries) long distances had a great effect on my overall inner peace- way more than any therapy.

      As someone who has always been more comfortable with thinking than feeling, feelings scared me until someone pointed out "emotions are just energy, waiting to be channeled". The intensity you feel is fuel that will enable you to change your world for the better if you stop and think strategically about your emotions before acting them out.

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    11. I dont act them out. Not anymore . I have changed I think. Unfortunately I intelluctualize the heck out of them. I am either paralyzed or panic. It takes me very long time to identify what to feel. I do escape. To feel alive, I escape. When I do physical stuff or immerse in my creative stuffl.. this is when I feel most alive. And when I focus on other peoples prohlems I feel most alive. I do use caffeine and sex and phyical stuff.. like the way me talked about they rush of dodging traffic by bicycle, you know? this is all supression. When I do quiet stuff lkie yoga or sittinI thinking doing nothing, or commuting with no distractions all i do is cry. For myself, I belive.If at a moving movie I cry. It is a release but day to day is spent in nervous inaction. It is very uncomfortable being awake and the minute 7 open my eyes in the morning, unless I have immediate task at hand, I would like to pretty much die. I need constant refocus of energy in order to enjoy my day. And I always want to nap.

      I am quiet borderline nobody can imagine I am. It feels like i am very present, and yet not present at all.

      I do not want to be nowhere woman, do you 6nders5and. If I could bottle my hypomania and sell it to myself,I would make fortune lol
      Thank you for listening.

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    12. You are so very kind.

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    13. I am convinced that our brains are continually developing, all of our lives. The emotional dysregulation that plagues you may subside somewhat on its own in a few years.
      You mentioned focusing on other people's problems as a way of escaping your internal strife. I think that's very admirable. There's no question that helping others is a great way to sublimate difficult emotions.

      Wishing you renewed courage and a peaceful sleep tonight.

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    14. thank you so very much, Machemp. I only saw that me using external things to make the internal feel better was kind of lame. I guess maybe i should not judge myself too badly. Nothing is ideal.

      Besides, Bill Clinton says his altruism comes from an entirely selfish place. I will put myself in his company LOlololllolololololl

      Wishing you peaceful dreams, too.

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  117. This has happened to me a few times. Certain people I knew used to think i had some kind of anger problem or got angry easier than most people but I hadn't been in a physical fight in years and the closest I got was when I stopped another two people from fighting. I rarely raised my voice and never got worked up over something someone would say. It seemed to just because of a certain "look" I had which was apparently somewhat broody

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  118. Oh soceez, you can't be mad your friends thought of you incorrectly when you lied about yourself. I see it all the time. First the socee says they hate something and so we all are mindful of it, then a month later suddenly they've always loved it and we're the rude ones for our thoughtfulness. Don't think your friends didn't catch it. They gave you the benefit of the doubt which is what you thrive on. And the ones who are closest to you that you think would tell you aren't going to. They are just egging you on for their own amusement because they're fascinated while telling themselves something else to justify it. Just stop being a little bitch and either remember your lie or ask your friend why they'd think you only drank healthy drinks or were a peaceful person and they can remind you. Then you can either be grateful someone respected your preferences or openly admit you are a violent caffeine addict and just lied all those times and that you do it all the time becuz yous a soceeeeee. Hope it helps you out bud. Glad to see people even admitting what they are and seeking feedback to learn more. I deal with one at work and they are too dumb to know that they are a socee and have a stupid time through life. Of course, I ain't gonna tell um nothin. Woo-ah-ah..

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    Replies
    1. Do you really feel as empty as a door,a rock, a wall? I honestly don't get that.
      There are things your passionate about?

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    2. I am a Socio, and i wear masks around friends, and if a friend of mine is mad because i lied to him about something that does not concern him, it's enough for me to get him out of my life permanantly and without hesitation, but it's rare when i get caught, i never forget a lie.

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    3. How come you get rid of them for that?

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    4. Because their a socio and they don't care. And maybe their trying to cover their tracks a little.

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  119. Oh, well that makes sense. But what if the person is still useful to you, 309? Or if the person is a threat now that they know sthg they shouldnt. Iow, if they have goods on you, but you cant be sure what they will do with their info abt you??

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  120. I personally would not betray a friend. That makes it sad for me, because they could care less how much they hurt me.

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  121. Howbout you do all the work, and I just sit here and take credit :)

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  122. No one can 'betray' me, because I can trust 100% that people will not always do what I want them to. Everyone got their own agenda.

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    Replies
    1. thats exactly right. people will always do what they want. nothing they do can be taken personally.

      and if you replace the word " betray" with "love" then you will not take another's love personally either. <<That's suicide-worthy

      I mean what exactly can one take personally?

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    2. Some people can be trusted, some people can't. I'm learning it feels a whole lot better to interact and be friends with people that are nice.

      It makes for a much happier day.

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    3. Yes you are right.

      Delete

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