Thursday, July 14, 2011

Quintessential sociopath traits

I've been thinking recently about the diagnostic criterion for sociopathy/psychopathy/ASPD (to the extent that they overlap and/or are largely conflated with each other).

The dominant diagnostic tools are Cleckley's checklist, Hare's PCL-R, and the DSM-IVs criterion for ASPD. None of these diagnostic tools require all traits to be manifested in a patient in order to be labeled a sociopath. All of the diagnostic tools are based on the observable traits of those who have been diagnosed as sociopaths, which, apart from being rather circular, introduces the risk of biases that might skew which traits get included or not included -- biases of the researchers, of a particular context (e.g. prison), of cultural differences, or of possible comorbidity with other disorders. And of course, not every sociopath will look the same because even if they had the same "sociopath genes" (if such exist), those genes would still manifest themselves differently based on environment, intelligence, gender, age, education, other factors of their upbringing, etc.

With all of that said, I'm curious what people people think are the quintessential sociopathic traits. I thought we could pool our collective opinions, as a straw poll. With that in mind, I'm going to include Cleckley's checklist, Hare's PCL-R, and the DSM-IV list of traits. Could everyone who wants to participate choose 5 traits that you think are the most common, predominant, or defining traits of a sociopath? If you think that a trait is necessary to a diagnosis, could you put an asterisk by that particular trait? Finally, if you believe that there is an essential trait that is not included in any of the diagnostic criterion listed below, feel free to include them, indicated with a hashtag (#). I wonder if we'll do a better job coming to a consensus than others have.

Cleckley:
1. Considerable superficial charm and average or above average intelligence.
2. Absence of delusions and other signs of irrational thinking.
3. Absence of anxiety or other “neurotic” symptoms. Considerable poise, calmness and verbal facility.
4. Unreliability, disregard for obligations no sense of responsibility, in matters of little and great import.
5. Untruthfulness and insincerity.
6. Antisocial behavior which is inadequately motivated and poorly planned, seeming to stem from an inexplicable impulsiveness.
7. Inadequately motivated antisocial behavior.
8. Poor judgment and failure to learn from experience.
9. Pathological egocentricity. Total self-centeredness and an incapacity for real love and attachment.
10. General poverty of deep and lasting emotions.
11. Lack of any true insight; inability to see oneself as others do.
12. Ingratitude for any special considerations, kindness and trust.
13. Fantastic and objectionable behavior, after drinking and sometimes even when not drinking. Vulgarity, rudeness, quick mood shifts, pranks for facile entertainment.
14. No history of genuine suicide attempts.
15. An impersonal, trivial, and poorly integrated sex life.
16. Failure to have a life plan and to live in any ordered way, unless it be for destructive purposes or a sham.

Hare:
· glib and superficial charm
· grandiose estimation of self
· need for stimulation
· pathological lying
· conning and manipulative
· lack of remorse or guilt
· shallow affect
· callousness and lack of empathy
· parasitic lifestyle
· poor behavioral control
· sexual promiscuity
· early behavior problems
· lack of realistic long-term goals
· impulsivity
· irresponsibility
· juvenile delinquency
· failure to accept responsibility for own actions
· revocation of conditional release
· many short-term marital relationships
· criminal versatility

DSM-IV
- failure to conform to social norms with respect to lawful behaviors as indicated by repeatedly performing acts that are grounds for arrest;
- deception, as indicated by repeatedly lying, use of aliases, or conning others for personal profit or pleasure;
- impulsiveness or failure to plan ahead;
- irritability and aggressiveness, as indicated by repeated physical fights or assaults;
- reckless disregard for safety of self or others;
- consistent irresponsibility, as indicated by repeated failure to sustain consistent work behavior or honor financial obligations;
- lack of remorse, as indicated by being indifferent to or rationalizing having hurt, mistreated, or stolen from another;

200 comments:

  1. Top 5 Traits of a SociopathJuly 14, 2011 at 3:50 AM

    1. Considerable retardation and average or above average douchebaggery.

    2. Considerable retardation and average or above average douchebaggery.

    3. Considerable retardation and average or above average douchebaggery.

    4. Considerable retardation and average or above average douchebaggery.

    5. Considerable retardation and average or above average douchebaggery.

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  4. your comments give me a headache, erin.

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  7. erin, could you please try to only make a comment when you have somethin real to say. and, no offence, but do you not have much going on for you in your life at the moment? you seem to spend all day everyday on sw. go outside and get some fresh air already woman!

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  11. Not much working going on there I bet...

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  12. hi hi,, please to tell me how U know i was socio,, please to tell me how U know i was very bad socio,,, please to tell me how U know i was very very bad socio,, please to U tell me now,,

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  13. Man I'm so depressed that I can't seem to know myself one bit. I don't know if I have any of those traits. I guess this counts as lack of insight, but that's all I know about myself, that I can't see myself at all.

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  15. "I am very versatile"

    lol that means u sit on ur fat ass doing nothing or you go to sleep lol (;

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  17. go outside and get some fresh air already woman!

    Yeah, Erin, stop making so much white noise and go outside for some fresh air or a fag already.

    I don't know about you, but I find pretending to be looking at things, or pretending to be going places I'm really not, much more fun than flinging projections at people sniggering at me :D

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  18. lol erin is a fat cunt and her bf pretended to be socio to get rid of her lol stupid whore (;

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  20. I guess this counts as lack of insight, but that's all I know about myself, that I can't see myself at all.

    Holy crap, you have got to be the world's BEST manipulator, Andrew. I am now going to refute your claim by telling you ALL about myself to prove to you that I DO indeed have insight. So there!

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  21. *grandiose estimation of self

    *lack of remorse or guilt

    *callousness and lack of empathy

    *impulsivity

    *conning and manipulative

    *Untruthfulness and insincerity

    *irritability and aggressiveness, as indicated by repeated physical fights or assaults;

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  23. I didn't see this listed so I made my own list. I have attempted to keep it short.

    Here it is:

    1. Evil

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  24. I am going to BORE you away .
    With my babble,so YOU are not so curious :) :)

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  25. Socio watch like bird watchJuly 14, 2011 at 5:57 AM

    I am over 50 and have been attracted to lively personalities all my life. Up until 50 I never realized that there is a higher chance of getting socios in that crowd, GLIB SURE COMES ACROSS AS LIVELY.

    I SOMEHOW managed to be entertained around socios without letting them suck anything from me, but I always had a gut feeling of something is not right. Of course, the socios I am referring to are the socio next door kind not the dumb/physical ones who actually drop the mask and/or manage to get caught with their shit.

    Finally I am aware of this type of people, and I have nothing against them (comedy of errors?) unless they put a severe dent in someone I care for.

    So, now that I am generally aware of the socio traits I look for them deliberately and I see the following five (in the order I listed) come out slowly when indeed there is a socio in my day.

    1. deception, as indicated by repeatedly lying, use of aliases, or conning others for personal profit or pleasure
    THEY ACTUALLY TAKE PLEASURE IN SHARING WITH YOU SOME OF THEIR VERY MINOR, POINTLESS LIES THAT HAVE TO DO WITH SOMEBODY ELSE, OR SOMEWHERE ELSE. YOU HEAR ONE OF THESE AND YOU KNOW A KEY TRAIT IS IN FRONT OF YOU.

    2. lack of remorse, as indicated by being indifferent to or rationalizing having hurt, mistreated, or stolen from another;
    THIS ONE IS ALSO EASY TO OBSERVE. SAY A CHILD IS CRYING OUT LOUD, A SOCIO MAY REPEATEDLY LAUGH AT THIS WHILE LOOKING WITH A STEADY STARE AT THE CHILD, OR DO THINGS TO ADD TO THE CHILD'S DISCOMFORT. S/HE WOULD BE THE LAST ONE TO ACTUALLY DO ANYTHING IN AN ATTEMPT TO HELP THE CHILD OR THE MOTHER. A SOCIO COULD EVEN ENJOY THE CHAOS THE CRYING IS CREATING IN OTHERS WHO ARE TRYING TO HELP AND KEEP OBSERVING NOT ONLY THE CHILD BUT THE OTHERS IN THE PICTURE INTENTLY.

    3. reckless disregard for safety of self or others;
    THIS IS VERY CLEAR WHEN YOU ARE TAKING A RIDE IN THEIR CAR. AT THE BEGINNING OF THE RELATIONSHIP THEY MAY CATER TO YOUR NEEDS IN THE CAR, BUT AS THE RELATIONSHIP GETS COMFORTABLE OR AS THEY FEEL LIKE IT THEY MAY TURN INTO A CRAZY ASS DRIVER ENJOYING THE FEAR INSTILLED IN THEIR PASSENGERS.

    4. consistent irresponsibility, as indicated by repeated failure to sustain consistent work behavior or honor obligations;
    THESE ARE THE ONES WHO STEADILY ARE LATE TO THEIR APPOINTMENTS OR WHO OFTEN ARE THE NO SHOWS. THEY COME WITH A GREAT SET OF EXCUSES AND MAY MAKE YOU FEEL SO SORRY FOR WHY THEY COULD NOT MAKE THE MEETING.

    5. impulsiveness or failure to plan ahead;
    SAY TRAFFIC IS TOO HEAVY, A SOCIO MAY ACTUALLY STOP THE CAR AND LEAVE IT IN THE MIDDLE OF THE HIGHWAY AND WALK AWAY WITH HIS ONLY REGRET BEING UNABLE TO WATCH THE CHAOS THAT FOLLOWED.


    For you the fun starts once you identify a socio while being able to keep an emotional distance. Just like reading a fiction piece about a bad character, observing a socio in action is really a great live entertainment for as long as you can keep the attitude of 'don't get involved or interfere with wild life' as if you are on a safari in a safe car.

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    1. you are an idiot. Your translations of these characteristics are extreme and unreliable. I do suffer from antisocial personality disorder (sociopathy) and I would NEVER do any of the things you listed. Let the DSM do its job and stray from what you cannot relate to.

      Have a good day.

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  26. Death threats are less effort Erin.

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  27. sociopath = total motherfucker with no redeeming qualities.

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    1. thanks...
      remember: Lack of emotion. not devoid of emotions

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  28. why does sociapaths think peeple see them as redeemable

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  29. anon 5:26, I am serious. I haven't got the slightest idea if I am a sociopath even though I can sense that something is wrong with me. If you ask me what it is I can't tell you cause I feel it but I don't know what it is. I always go to my psychiatrist with another problem, only to find that it has cured by itself. I always invent things that are wrong with me.

    I don't have any problems. I just feel angst. For no reason.

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  31. You're right Erin. From now on I won't go to the psychiatrist anymore. Will you be my confident? We can talk about all kinds of stuff. What do you say? Let's be friends. :)

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  33. I wasn't being sarcastic. Leave me your IM id and we'll talk.

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  34. "I am trained as a counselor."

    That's a frightening thought.

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  36. "The shrinks are the worst JERKS to talk trash and take money from people."

    Haha. This coming from a "psychic".

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  38. Ok Erin, I'm just waiting to get into your graces. :)

    Btw, I feel for you and your socio boyfriend. I understand that he made you feel good about yourself but also was bad for you. I know that feeling all too well.

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  40. Master Socio TrainerJuly 14, 2011 at 6:25 AM

    Oh dear, you fail, underling.

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  41. You do need the truth, ErinJuly 14, 2011 at 6:29 AM

    ERin said:
    Well Andrew
    I would have to get a feel for you before I did that.
    I AM talking to one person from here but my guy told me he was OK.
    My gut has not told me that yet about you so I will have to wait and see :)

    ERIN,
    I think you meant my gut said he was OK but your subconscious seems to have the truth in your general attitude and made you say 'my GUY told me ...OK."

    Urgently: stop psychic bullshit and stop listening to your GUY consciously. It is amazing that the observations you made about psychologists apply to you but you are not totally aware of that. You still have mommy issues to get rid of before being able to help anyone. I started to think what you may consider as mom abuse actually is an honest attempt of a mother to fix some of your serious problems that have to do with your sexuality. Why don't you tell us more how exactly your mother abused you, and what she was thinking?

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  42. Master Socio TrainerJuly 14, 2011 at 6:31 AM

    You still fail, and have much to learn, underling.

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  43. Shut the fuck up Master Ass Licker. What do you know? You're like a Yoda without the wisdom. Stupid fuck. Get your faggot ass out of here.

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  45. Omg, check this out, this is awsome. I love this guy.

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  47. why does sociapaths talk about them selfs so much

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  48. And for my next trickJuly 14, 2011 at 6:44 AM

    Poor Grasshopper :(

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  49. Why you ask sociopaths talk about themselves so much...

    Actually, every one talks about themselves too much. It's the manner in which sociopaths talk about themselves that makes the difference.

    Look at Erin, she talks about herself here and she must do the same with her friends. The thing is she always presents herself as the underdog, not threatening anybody or causing insecurities in the others since she is more than willing to accept that she is weak, at 100% as she put it. When a sociopath talks s/he would never accept to being weak like that unless s/he has quick gains to rip from the situation, and get out. Socios are proud of themselves, remember that grandiose self trait, and it's that kind of grandiose talk that could be (think NOTE talking)off-putting to others because it taps on the insecurities of the weak and irritates the hell out of the ones who have the same trait (think barking socios here when one is more a talk than walk the talk).

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  50. http://www.kmbc.com/video/22716297/detail.html

    This is the link to the part 1 of the full interview. This guy is awsome.

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  51. How does someone like the guy in the video except being caged up?

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  52. Well, he got caught. Didn't you listen? He preferred death to being caged.

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  53. Socio traits (today's post) :

    * Lock on, or sustained ego-centric self-interest.

    Which bleeds into obsession, accomplishment and hunting for the prize. Ever see a cat zero in on a bird. It's in the eyes. Thus one cannot see evil, hear evil, or speak it. They become it, if the focus is destruction. Now if the focus is life affirming, then there exists a 'take no prisoners' approach to winning the prize which contributes to the many, such as a cure to a disease. The killer instinct is focused upon the elimination of disease.

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  54. "If I get sent to hell, I'll spend the whole eternity trying to take over hell"

    --John Hughes

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  55. Example: Zuckerberg of Facebook. This trait is also borderlines as an aspie trait. It is a power drive trait in socios. Think dictators.

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  56. I think SP is going through a manic phase. I'd love to hate her for all this schizo babble, but hey, it is what it is. The sun is out, and so are my boobies. C ya later.

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  57. Rip( the resurrected)July 14, 2011 at 7:34 AM

    I guess I'm back

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  58. notme, just for you and your sun kissed boobies I am going back on a religious sabbatical. Not manic, that is a projection of your love of the sun.

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  59. Lol ok. :)

    I was wondering where you'd gone actually, and out you popped. We need more of the other old regulars too.

    Oh and hello Rip. How was death?

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  60. I am a nice guy. I am a special socio in that I treat others with kindness.

    Here is an example. I was M.E.'s "travel companion". ...We keep our distance but hunt and compete for women for sport.

    we met Erin while trapesing trough a foreign land. She told our fortunes, then left us in a youth hostel double dildoed up, ass to ass. She then took polaroids of M.E. but only of his ass and face and left my face out. She ran downstairs to the manager with said polaroids, and the manager called the local police. (We left the restaurant without paying the night before ...)Before they arrived, she yanked me free and we fled the scene. I let Erin go home (we now live together as she figured out I was the one who LIkEd ass play.) I am an unusual socio in that I stood by M.E. through his ordeal with his captives, who wouldn't mend his or ass. I sutured him with KINDNESS. M.E. is home recovering but won't talk about it. See. i am considerate. I am warning you fags, don't tease him about said incident. He is smarting, dammit. <<This right here is my empathy and I am proud of it. I know what it's like to have a virgin ass. Erin is home laughing at "work" while I am still smarting from the experience. I am the only socio i know who has empathy. Eat this post I am one of the good guys, and Erin will attest to this. Fuck this list.

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    1. According to the definition I have heard used on this site, if you have empathy you are not a sociopath. Did I miss something?

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  61. why is sociapaths so bad at thinking out side the box bout peeple

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  62. I have very broad eclectic taste in many things, but my main passions are music, coffee & travel.

    I'm very easy going, low stress, confident person with a warped cheeky sense of humour. Sometimes I may seem shy, but ooze with charisma.

    As they say, "It's the quite ones you have to watch!"

    I'm very respectful of other peoples space, ways & opinions. I'm a very calm person who tends to have a relaxing valium type effect on people.

    I always enjoy great conversation.

    When I love to do something, I do it wholeheartedly and sometimes a little obsessively.

    I'm a pet lover with very adorable puppy & eccentric fat cat.

    I'm fairly well travelled and love to travel when the opportunity arises. Some of my favourite destinations so far have been: Japan, Germany, Denmark, Netherlands, France, UK, USA, Fiji and Canada. I would really like to see more of Scandinavia and see South America. Also would love to get back to Japan!

    I enjoy going out to see music, films and exhibitions, but also spending time at home NOT watching my extremely obsolete TV. However, I do have a nice computer screen and excellent speakers which are great for watching films :)

    I'm studying a Bachelor of Fine Art & work in IT (Apple Computers.)

    I am a total gourmet coffee snob and also love good food.
    My favourite coffee beans are roasted at St Ali.
    I also love to drink tea.

    I really enjoy getting out of the city when life isn't to busy.

    I love producing music, drumming in various bands and tinkering with my synthesizers & guitar when I have time.

    I like to collect limited edition prints and designer toys when I can afford them.

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    1. You sound like the most stereotypical "cool indie guy" ever. (not that that's a bad thing)

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  63. .-*fun.*.creative-.*.-musical.*.guy*-.

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  65. Socio Jack is unto something... Tell us more about your fictitious take on the characters.

    I notice without the regulars taking ME seriously and responding to her request (in this case your view on what top 5 traits are) the site is less interesting. Who but ME would know that socios can't stay connected too long, are not very cooperative unless it's their idea, are not able to focus or have deep insight.

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  66. 1. Grandiose sense of self worth.

    (Looks down upon everyone, see certain people as trash. Extreme narcissism and grandiose, may state readily that their goal is to rule the world.)

    2. Bizzare mannerisms/body language.

    3. Failure to follow any life plan.

    (Has no real interests, passion or ambition, fakes being interested in certain subjects to look good or to gain power.)

    4. Unresponsiveness in general interpersonal relations.

    5. Parasitic lifestyle.

    (Takes from others without ever giving back.)

    6. Callous lack of empathy.

    (Exercises despotic control over every aspect of the victim's life)

    7. Cunning and manipulative.

    (They never recognize the rights of others and see their self-serving behaviors as permissible. They appear to be charming, yet are covertly hostile and domineering, seeing their victim as merely an instrument to be used. They may dominate and humiliate their victims)

    8. Pathological lying.

    (Has no problem lying coolly and easily and it is almost impossible for them to be truthful on a consistent basis. Can create, and get caught up in, a complex belief about their own powers and abilities. Extremely convincing and even able to pass lie detector tests. Lies about achievements and will not think twice about changeing life story at will)

    9. Emotionally shallow.

    (Incapable of real human attachment to another)

    10. Impulsive.

    (Cannot plan ahead)

    11. Conventional appearance

    (Plain, blends in)

    12. Authoritarian.

    (Hates to be an equal)

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  67. Yeah, what's with that? Asking us which traits are top 5? What is that even supposed to mean?

    How do you know that ME is a girl?

    When is ME going to post something worth reading?

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  68. You're losing control over the blog ME...

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  69. I have every single trait. UJELLY?

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  70. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6gWiVSmjTas

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  72. 1. Listens to nin

    2. Wears black

    3. Loves cats

    4. Hates all ASSHOLES

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  73. I like me some cats too lools

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  74. 1. exceptionally talented at everything

    2. you can't beat me

    3. you can't beat me

    4. i'm far too good

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  75. Profile of the inferior antisocialJuly 14, 2011 at 12:14 PM

    1. hates pedos

    2. hates the police

    3. dirty druggie

    4. can't go 10 minutes without mugging someone

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  76. psycho for help with directionsJuly 14, 2011 at 12:25 PM

    A New York man has been arrested on suspicion of murder after the dismembered remains of an 8-year-old boy were found in his apartment.

    Leibby Kletzky was declared missing when he failed to meet his family on Monday after his walk home from day camp in Brooklyn's Borough Park neighborhood.

    Police say they have surveillance tapes showing the boy encountering 35-year-old Levi Aron outside a dentist's office.

    A search by police and members of the neighborhood's tightly knit Orthodox Jewish community led authorities to the suspect's apartment early yesterday.

    Detectives found what were believed to be the boy's remains in Mr Aron’s refrigerator

    The boy seemed to have lost his way and had asked Mr Aron, a stranger he met on the street, for directions, police said.

    "He was trying to find his way apparently," New York police department commissioner Ray Kelly said, adding: "This is every parent's nightmare. That's what makes this so horrific."

    Confronted by police in his apartment, Mr Aron pointed to his kitchen, where blood was visible on the handles of the freezer, commissioner Kelly said. Inside was a bloodied cutting board, three knives and body parts believed to be the boy's.

    Mr Aron led police to a rubbish container about 4km away, where more remains were found, wrapped in a plastic rubbish bag. Mr Aron was subsequently arrested on a charge of second-degree murder.

    "It was just happenstance and a terrible fate for this young boy."

    The boy apparently was alive until Mr Aron saw the activity and extent of the search conducted by the police and the community, Mr Kelly said.

    "He panicked and that's why he killed the boy," Mr Kelly claimed, citing statements from the suspect. He said the search had been a "full-court press" by police, members of the community and a neighborhood patrol.

    The boy's parents had agreed to let him walk by himself seven blocks from camp to a meeting point halfway home, commissioner Kelly said. They walked the route with him last Friday, he said. "Parents have to make certain judgments. There's no easy answer. It's just a terrible, terrible tragedy."

    Mr Aron did not have a criminal record and works as a clerk at a maintenance supply company in Brooklyn, he said

    Asked if the suspect was a member of the same religious community as the victim, commissioner Kelly said: "He had all of the trappings of being an Orthodox Jew."

    The suspect lives in the attic apartment of a three-story house owned by his family.

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  77. socios are totally beatable
    the trick is to appear sincere with them and don't let them know you are on to them, then it's good times as you guide them to the abyss

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  78. profile of the fat antisocialJuly 14, 2011 at 12:59 PM

    1. hates vegitables and all other nutritious food, as indicated by repeated assaults on waiters for serving salad as a side dish

    2. steals candy from babies

    3. sleeps in the bathroom of mcdonalds after closing time

    4. ruthlessly preys upon regular fat people so as to 'eliminate the competition'

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  80. # Obsession with power dynamics. Always needs to be in control.

    * manipulative/conning
    * lack of empathy. Doesn't care for the rights of others
    * Impulsive
    * Grandiose sense of self worth / distain for others

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  82. levi the socio confesses like this, duhhhJuly 14, 2011 at 1:41 PM

    Levi Aron's confession in the murder of 8-year-old Brooklyn child Leiby Kletzky has taken the Internet by storm, since it was obtained from police and published by NBC New York.

    Brooklyn resident Levi Aron confessed to killing a child, in what is one of the most grisly murders to hit the greater New York area in a while.

    Police found Kletzky's remains in a refrigerator at Levi Aron's Brooklyn apartment.

    The following is the full text of the confession as published by NBC New York:

    My name is Levi Aron... On Monday evening around 5:30 I went to my dentist, Dr. Sorcher, to make a payment for visit for exam routine.

    A boy approached me on where the Judaica book store was. He was still there when went out from the dentist's office. He asked me for a ride to the Judaica book store. While on the way he changed his mind and wasn't sure where he wanted to go.

    So I asked if he wanted to go for the ride - wedding in Monsey - since I didn't think I was going to stay for the whole thing since my back was hurting. He said ok.

    Due to traffic, I got back around 11:30 p.m. ... so I brought him to my house thinking I'd bring him to his house the next day. He watched TV then fell asleep in the front room. I went to the middle room to sleep. That next morning, he was still sleeping when I was ready to leave.

    So I woke him and told him I'll bring him to his house... when I saw the flyers I panicked and was afraid. When I got home he was still there so I made him a tuna sandwich....

    I was still in a panic ... and afraid to bring him home. That is when approximately I went for a towel to smother him in the side room. He fought back a little bit until eventually he stopped breathing.

    Afterwards I panicked because I didn't know what to do with the body.... carried parts to the back room placing parts between the freezer and the refrigerator ...

    ... went to clean up a little then took a second shower. I panicked and .. Then putting the parts in a suitcase. Then carrying suitcase to the car ...placing in backseat on floor behind passenger side.

    ... drove around approximately around 20 minutes before placing it in the dumpster on 20th street just before 4th Avenue. Then went home to clean and organize.

    I understand this may be wrong and I'm sorry for the hurt that I have caused.

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  83. can always sue a socioJuly 14, 2011 at 1:46 PM

    A suburban Detroit woman is suing a Washington state man for more than $8,000 in damages after a failed Facebook romance.

    Fifty-year-old Cheryl Gray of Livonia filed the civil lawsuit in May against 35-year-old Wylie Iwan of Kennewick, Wash., claiming misrepresentation, defamation of character and other charges. She seeks repayment for gifts she bought during their six-month relationship, including a digital camera and Seattle Mariners’ home opener tickets.

    The single mother says they met playing Mafia Wars.

    Gray told WXYZ-TV she bought a plane ticket to visit him but a week before the planned trip he sent a message saying he met someone else.

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  84. *# lack of respect for boundaries, whether social or legal.
    * lack of remorse/guilt
    * criminal behaviour
    #* lack of self control
    * grandiose sense of self

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  85. mobilize the socio dadJuly 14, 2011 at 1:50 PM

    jail time entertainment...

    shameless guy makes child pornography, gets caught, put in jail, says he'll defend himself and gets the rights to watch the evidence against him, which is child pornography....
    now he is in the viewing room along with the proper watchful eyes watching his home-made movies... Yikes..

    while having snacks paid by tax-payers?

    Here comes the question? What would the socio father of the victim do?

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  86. @ soulful. I saw zuckerberg as an Aspie (singleminded, savant skills, obsessional, socially daft) and fanning as the socio (fresh from a former career destroying the music business, used charm to seduce zuckerberg and netted at least $$$,$$$,$$$ blowing lines with the kids.) Zuckerberg response to the betrayal, black and white heart of an Aspie.

    @Aspie you are the soul of wit at brevity today.

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  88. Kesu and Zwaq condone molesting children. Me, I think child molesters are little wierdos. Poking around in little michaels boxers is pretty fucking weird if you ask me.

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  90. That's pretty messed up. I think ME has a link to a pedophile manifesto book or something on the blog somewhere.

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  91. Sociopaths and law enforcement almost go hand and hand as being a criminal does. But that's just my personal experience.

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  92. Its a ploy to be edgey and push the limits. I'm not open minded enough for that shit. Nobodys convinced me that pedophiles aren't wierdo perverts. Even if they did declaring it would ruin your reputation.

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  93. you mean socio cops and socio criminals? that sounds just fine, as long as they don't cooperate.

    like more dexters... how lovely...

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  95. what's worse, pedophellia or incest?

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  96. "Even if they did declaring it would ruin your reputation"

    lol, yeah

    none of these traits are things I think anyone sensible would put on a resume

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  97. why does sociapaths stoopidly not uunderstand impathy.

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  98. I didn't know molesting children was a required trait of a sociopath.

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  99. Normaly child molesters arnt sociopaths.

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  100. it's not a required trait but even these somewhat more common lesser evils are nothing anyone wants to declare, nevermind messing with kids

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  102. this book:

    Psychopathy. Antisocial, Criminal and Violent Behaviour.
    by Theodore Millon


    makes the case that most pedophiles are psychopathic

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  103. In most cases it comes from a adult not being able to bond with adults. They develop a need to bond with children. Thats a simplified version. Like I said: wierdos.

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  104. It depends on the type of child molestor. The sexually violent ones tend to be psychopaths. That doesn't mean a majority of psychopaths are child molestors. It just means when we do something we go all the way.

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  105. Probably the worst psychopathic serial killer of all time in terms of outright depravity and cruelty was also a pedophile.

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  106. Im sure fare amount are socio/psychopaths however from what I understand for a large portion Its a lack impulse control alot of child molesters feel shame, remorse and they try to rationalize there behavior. " Im doing this because that little girl was teasing me... It cant be that bad if it was leagal at some point in history...he was just playing hard to get...etc".

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  107. Westley allan dodd was a child molester and the most evil killer EVER.

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  108. Is that who you were talking about aspie?

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  109. The point was not that pedophilia is a sociopath trait. The point was obviously declared "pedophilia" could damage the rep. Back to the context of this thread stemming from the original blog post, declaring anything listed here is not going to benefit anyones rep either. Sociopathy is already a bad rep.

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  110. no not him, though I am sure he was terrible

    i am thinking of someone not very well known but pretty bad and actually influential

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  112. if there is a correlation between kiddy-fiddling and 'pathy, then does that mean there's a lot of psychopathic priests?

    i'd say a sociopath is more likely to commit statutory rape than be a paedo - a sexual predator doesn't evolve to be interested in fucking a girl who doesn't bleed.

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  113. no, that guy was small time

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  114. Are sociopaths always bullies?
    Who are most likely to be bullies, sociopaths or narcissists?

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  115. Rip( the undead)July 14, 2011 at 3:43 PM

    This time I'm really back

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  116. this guy

    gacy said he got some of his ideas from him

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  117. I'm a big baby if I don't get what I want. Mostly people listen to me, though. Erin the reason you get used is because you make yourself available to be used. Every time is the last straw for you. Its so easy to get you back when you make up the excuses to do so yourself. Its almost cute imagining you telling yourself your going to stand up to him. Do you practice or daydream?

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  118. the wikipedia article is off though ... he raped all the victims in addition to torture, glass rods in the urethra and smashed etc... and admitted to his accomplises that he was a pedophile and prefered very young boys etc... i think he is one of the worst if not the

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  120. Sounds like your finest hour. Did it feel good? Or was the feel of shame from public embarrassment to overwhelming to feel such pleasanteries.

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  123. You sound like a couple of muppets. When I go places people know what's mine. Crying for people is pathetic. Its emotional masochism. I bet you love feeling sorry for people. You see the good in people.

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  124. Im 16. I thought of killing my friend. I often lie. I hate when people go against me so I bring up others bad memory so they can focus on that instead of going against me. Im smiling of my friends bad stories. I have been bad to animals. I dont understand social norms, so i have read a lot and studied people. I love myself.

    How can i know if I have Sympathy? I only do whats best for me.

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  126. different pathways to highs and balance i guess

    nts get attached and love and feels the heights of deep joy

    sociopaths like to tear it down and get their neurotransmitter fix, to feel "good"

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  128. relatively normal people, if that exists (NeuroTypicals)

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  129. Rip( that guy that was awesomeJuly 14, 2011 at 5:57 PM

    RIPS back guys c'mon

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  132. Waah! Why can't I be a psychopathic-con-artist-cyber-crim-woman-beating-drug-peddling-paedophile-rapist? It's NOT fair!

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  133. And you had to supress your desires so they wouldn't be used against you?

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  135. Oh come now, Erin, I'm more than that.

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  137. people defend their beliefs and argue how they are this way and that like that is all there is.. i think part of this is people just wanting to be right and some of it is just ignorance

    i suspect not everything is so mind and thinking based/caused like many seem to "think"

    i think for example your "diet" has just as much impact on your personality if not a lot more than the way anyone treats you in your interactions

    people are lazy

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  139. why does sociapaths always act stoopid.

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  140. cos day iz stoopid?

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  143. aspie that psycho was a really bad one. I just finished reading about him. What beats me is how easy for him to find those two accomplices. One car and $200 a head to lure one victim in. AMazing how cheap human life can be... 26 kids at $200 means $5,2000, plus two cars....

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  144. @ not a socio... they were socios themselves .. confirmed by cell mates and others around them

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  145. like anybody gives a shit about your songs aspie you retard. stfu.

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  146. GUYS IT'S RIP REMEMBER

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  147. why does sociapaths always act stooopid, like they cant even thimk straight?

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  148. Rip( he be smarter than you)July 14, 2011 at 8:35 PM

    Cause they not Rip anymore

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  149. well obviously you did you bitch that's why you wrote something, dumb ass

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  150. A list will never be enough validation.
    You will always search for some perfect way to measure what you are.
    Knowing all the while, that you are still trapped in a fragile human casing.
    Your corpse will not defeat the soil it rots under, and your skull will not be placed on the platform at a museum.

    1. Sadist
    2. Puppeteer
    3. Con
    4. Impostor
    5. Parasite
    6. Cyclone
    7. Opiate
    8. Sniper
    9. Beguiler
    10. Machine

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  151. The reason musicians make fun of Weinberg, Aspie, is that he holds his drumsticks classically. They think he looks funny because it's unusual to see people bang the shit out of a kit NOT holding their sticks match style.

    He's awesome.

    Weinberg has fulcrums to die for.

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  152. one last thing... sometimes conversations strays to the topic of good and evil and usually evil is dismissed as something that we all contain and good is something one does for show... you know the deal

    i just would like to suggest that good is not always so "good" and that the idea that good always follows rules is insane...

    i would argue good is quite practical and quite vicious and contradictory at times in context...

    good is a nightmare to some, know that shit

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  153. Good a nightmare to the person who possesses the goodness.

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  154. why does sociapaths steal?

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  155. I got drunk the other day, and it was supposed to rain. I grabbed a random umbrella from behind somebody at the bar, thinking about how it was probably one of the drunk sluts dancing to the crap music. Of course, when I HAVE an umbrella, then I don't have to worry about the rain, even though it was only 15 minutes home. When I got home I realized that I had just stolen one similarly about a month ago. I am racking up the stolen umbrellas, and I don't feel guilty. Do normal people feel guilty about stupid shit like this? I hope not. It's such a waste of time. But I ponder it because my mother is so much different than me - hell, most people I know would be APALLED that I stole something as simple and silly as a damn umbrella -- it's just a deviant, adolescent thing to do, I am guessing. It's easier than going to CVS for a new one.

    Okay, so I am lying, it was more than 15 minutes home that night. I lie all the time, but that's another symptom.

    I drank to FEEL for a few years of my life but it doesn't work anymore.

    I look into this man's eyes and tell him I love him because my own lies bore me when I am sober, when I wake up, I realize I am trapped in the LOVE lie. Now I have to put the lilt in my voice.

    I am always trying to figure out what I am supposed to feel. Sometimes, I ask people flat out, such a silly mistake, but I DO get frustrated, what am I supposed to feel? what do you want me to say? It took me YEARS to realize normal people don't ask that question. And smart people who aren't normal shouldn't ask it out LOUD.

    Why the fuck do we slip up? Because life is boring. We can't plateau, because that's boring. Where's there an edge to fall off of?


    I am tired of having money, I am tired of NOT having money. I am tired of reading these blogs and feeling like you understand. I don't even think I care if you understand. It's just self-flagellation, congratulations to us all. Not being genuine. What is charm if not superficial? What is GENUINE charm?


    I went head to head with another socio a few months ago. Maybe that's why I am bored. That was overkill, somebody diagnosed as a psychopath trying to play head games with me and I didn't wanna play, he didn't get it, I wanted to win ONLY. He didn't get that. He brought all the disposable people out to be disposed of, thinking it would injure me. I didn't care. It bothered me that I am MORE STOIC than him, he had worked so hard on his prey and I just didn't care. I knew he would sacrifice them, I knew they would think I was monster, and they were, well, disposable. I was tired of those toys. They were broken.

    I went on this "moral kick" for a month. Wanted to practice that image. I forgot it with one drunk and now I am stealing umbrellas from pathetic drunk girls. Apparently regularly.

    That actually makes me smile, but that's not why I did it. I did it because I could.

    I think that's why I do things. Because I can. I get a strange thrill when I talk my way out of a lie and into another one.

    But this man I told I loved... I got bored. I got tired of earning money. I said, "why the fuck not?" "Why the fuck shouldn't I?" and it's funny, there are never any protesting voices to silence -- but I am acutely aware, nowadays, that there SHOULD be.

    Being a sociopath means that we can always answer our actions with that question. "Why the fuck not?" "Why the fuck shouldn't I?" and it's always rhetorical.

    Isn't THAT boring. I am bored. I look forward to good pot and and being treated like a queen, but I know that will bore me, even disgust me, in another week or two. If not tomorrow night.

    This will be my rant on this website, I won't appear again for months and you can forget me. But know I will be here reading.

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  156. ^pfff

    Hey anon 9:26. Your list is beautiful. And so long as we are all going to rot i'm going to be all those things and more. whatever i want

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  157. And hey justagirl... Like seriously, I could barely stand to read all that. Maybe next time you'll have learned the fine art of brevity

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  159. @just a girl

    You captured a lot of my inner thoughts. I am not the take someone else's umbrella type but I am bored. I am started to think socio or no socio it is good for us if we can find something that holds our interest for a while, and that we learn to let go when the interest disappears not so much with regret that it is over but with patience that there will soon be another one and it's ok to ride idle for a while.

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  162. why does sociapaths always never like anything?

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  164. Has anyone read the stranger beside me? It's an amazing book that delves into the mind of the most notorious psychopath to ever exist.

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  167. I get skulls into museumsJuly 15, 2011 at 12:50 PM

    really.

    Anon 9:26 a well thought out list.

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  168. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G4EwxEimqRA

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  169. Anon 9:26 Says...

    I made that list with my whole heart.

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  170. This might be a little off-topic (which still puts it closer than most of the comments here) but do sociopaths have a tendency to group on any particular profiles in Meyers-Briggs testing?

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  171. Forget the book “Go the F**k to Sleep”, a pathetic, soul-less, allegedly rebel, ‘children’s book’. Don’t waste your hard-earned money, instead read a BANNED book like “America Deceived II” by a real rebel and the “World’s Most Hated Author”, E.A. Blayre III.
    Last link (before Google Books bans it also]:
    http://www.iuniverse.com/Bookstore/BookDetail.aspx?BookId=SKU-000190526

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  172. www.angelfire.com/zine2/narcissism/CleckleyPsycho2.html

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  174. Having just discovered this blog today, I must say that it has made for hours of fascinating and insightful reading.

    Much but not all of this thread was an exception, however.

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  175. I think the major characteristics involve parasitic lifestlye and boredom. I am constantly needing to get support from other people because I sometimes fail to plan ahead in the sense of work and obligations. Also, the boredom is painful. Anything is better than the hateful feeling of ''I could be doing something interesting right now''.I never liked how socios were portrayed as ''dishonest'' as if EVERYTHING said was a lie. Sure the ability for manipulation is there, and the charm helps with that. But get one pissed off enough while no one else is around and you will see the purest form of truth come out in a person. I have attached a link to something I have written that perfectly defines sociopathy. ( In higher forms. )

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