Tuesday, July 5, 2011

Learning disabled?

A reader writes:
I wonder if the way the brain is organized plays a role in defining the personality? Isn't it possible that someone who struggles to read, or has some other learning challenges, also organizes and processes emotions and social cues differently?

The current approach to evaluating personality types seems like not much more than a game of battleship where you ignore misses to make sense of the hits. We assume that with enough therapy, or desire, personality is something we can change, without taking into account how we learn and navigate reality. That's a bit like having the body type of a sprinter and training for long distance running. Maybe we just are what we are?

According to this link, when the right brain becomes overstimulated, individuals become "anxious, pessimistic, and tense".

So, does an anxious and pessimistic individual have an anxious and pessimistic personality, or just an excessively active right hemisphere? I wonder if sociopathic personalities are right brained individuals, and for this reason are more impulsive and prone to risk taking than their left brained brethren? Or do they have their own unique hardwiring?

The brain is like a computer. Everything depends on its ability to input, process, store, and retrieve information. Understanding that hardwiring might allow us to develop new approaches to learning and to even "change".

57 comments:

  1. "The brain is like a computer"
    true, but the brain have endless memory.

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  3. ^ what a whore

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  4. what are you gretyl.... some sort of empathic eugenicist?

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  5. Why not just screen DNA for NT's, and abort anything that isn't.
    Would that not be an empathic thing to do?

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  7. Hare himself now admits he doesn't think sociopathy is a personality disorder. That being said your 'options' are tantamount to lobotomy. Why fix what isn't broke? If they are now saying that they think they would find more sociopaths in the board room than in prison what does that say to you?
    Here's a option for you: Get back to work you fucking tool, and stop complaining.
    This past few years I have heard 'issues' with people who are seductive, successful, impulsive, and get what they want on a constant basis. The whiners, like you Gretyl, have all been exposed to be suckers and haters who were forgotten into the void of the unimportant after being used and discarded by people better than them.

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  8. "One day sociopaths will be catagorized with other disablities.

    Hopefully, a DNA screen, as they do with Down's Syndrome, will be possible."


    You sound like a covert sociopath that doesn't want competition.

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  9. She is talking from an empaths point of view. Sociopaths are harming normal people. It isn't about them being disordered or not that doesn't matter, it's the fact that they are causing damage.

    Psychopathy affects less than one percent of the population, cut out the intelligent ones from the dumb sociopaths and you have a much smaller number, then take out the ones that aren't interested in business, smaller again. After you single out all these factors the chances of coming across a psychopath in business is very rare.

    Imo, the number is less than one percent, as i've yet to witness a sociopath first hand.

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  10. Lucky you, I have witnessed a sociopath first hand and believe me it is no picnic. The sad thing is that she is the most miserable soul I've yet to meet but walks around like life is grand. Such a pretender.

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  11. Your personal experience has no bearing on statistics.
    This is like my wife twisting every action I do into a destructive act. She's so blinded by the stuff I need to do to keep things moving, she doesn't look at the fact that there's a significiant amount of people whos lives I've changed and see me as a inspiration including herself.
    The cases where sociopaths ruin lives are sensationalized. How many sociopaths are really murderers and rapists? Sociopaths can cause a lot if devestationbif they want to. The few that have have been sensationalised to the point where we are all sleeping in the same blanket.

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  12. I can tell you she's not pretending. Your just so miserable you can't understand her. Empathy and emotional depth cloud reality.

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  13. Ukan is obviously a Ucan't!!! You have no idea what you are talking about and like I said she is a miserable soul as you appear to be. Me on the other hand am oh so okay. Understand her?? I am one of the few who does understand her and that's why I made the comment I made. When you KNOW her then you can speak on my comment.

    And clouded reality fits you quite well.

    P.S. Sounds like you are the one sensationaling this because I never said she was a murderer, etc but she is a dead soul who has admitted to just how miserable she is using, stealing, lying, and reinventing herself at the drop of a hat. I am so glad to know who I am and how to treat people.

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  14. Where might I find a new pet sociopath?

    Sadly, the one I have has become too deliberately obtuse when he barks, and whines excessively when he's poked with a stick.

    I know a sociopath is not just for Christmas, but I believe I made a mistake in getting a cryptic breed, and will shortly be drowning him in a bucket.

    If you know of any ignoramus sociopaths available, feral or domesticated, please let me know.

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  15. Do sociopaths have primarily a choleric temperament or can sociopaths have other temperaments?

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  16. this is retarded.

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  17. Well yes, I do believe the choleric temperament is that of despots.

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  18. I get it but how do you come to the conclusion that sociopathic individuals are pessimistic, anxious and tense ?

    In my opinion they're exactly the opposite. They are cold and calculated. The signals from the right side of the brain don't even come to announce the left brain to act. It seems to me that right brain damage would be the cause...

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  19. @mylomis I will take your crypticpath.

    He will be be welcome addition to my collection of carnivorous plants and will enjoy many happy days of photogenically improbabe breeding experiments.

    As if that is not enough, we have margarita night on Wednesdays.

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  20. Of course the way the brain is organized plays a role in defining the personality. Chemistry is what makes us function the way we do. It’s rather common sense if you ask me. Just how much that chemistry comes into play is the question though. Someone, no matter what they’re environmental/nurture aspect is not going to develop a PD if they didn’t have some inborn biogenetic temperament towards having a PD. That doesn’t mean they won’t suffer from environmental trauma, but they won’t necessarily develop a full blown disorder. It’s also why being raised in a relatively wonderful environment (like I was) does not preclude one from developing a PD either.

    It’s all a mosh of nature and nurture; how our environments contributed to the nature we were born with. I’m sure I would have been more ASPD rather than BPD if I was raised in a less hospitable environment, but as it is, I learned some coping and control growing up so I’m not quite the anti-soc I could have been though I’m still considered disordered.

    I’m also inclined to agree that PDs have little to nothing to do with overstimulated ‘right brain’ functions. There have been studies that show that the underdevelopment of certain aspects of the brain contribute to being more impulsive behavior though. Over/under regulation of certain brain areas and glands, yes, but this right brain/left brain stuff is bullshit.

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  21. Your personal experience has no bearing on statistics.
    This is like my wife twisting every action I do into a destructive act. She's so blinded by the stuff I need to do to keep things moving, she doesn't look at the fact that there's a significiant amount of people whos lives I've changed and see me as a inspiration including herself.


    Ukan,

    That attitude of yours is a one-way train to splitsville.

    Here's some unsolicited advice:

    Just because you can force yourself on others (your wife), doesn't invalidate her perspective.

    You can expand that little exercise to the whole world, if you ever wanna.

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  23. So let me get this straight: You just said that this sociopath you met first hand is 'miserable' so you say, right? Without skipping a beat you say she walks around like life is grand, and explain it as pretending. Wake up you wanker. You don't understand her at all. We aren't suffering you cunt. That persons happieness is genuine. Just because someone isn't weighed down by petty emotions and empathy you think they are suffering.
    In fact it is you who are on this site because you care about her. I guarantee you the opposite is not the case. She probably isn't giving you a second thought. You think you know her? If you know her so well what are you doing here searching for answers.

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  24. Teaspoon: The rest of the world is here for my amusement. People like yourself don't matter, which is why you rant and rave your jealousy on here.
    Other peoples perspectives are wrong. I find it typical that you find inspiration to be stifling. People like you are a downer.

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  25. Sucks to be you, UKan. Sounds like you married a "downer" :D

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  26. I help her spirits when I can, Spoon.
    Gretel I find it funny that you wont argue with a psychopath because they are disabled, yet its people like you who get manipulated by them.

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  28. Its even easier when supposed sane people go along with whatever you tell them. You think its a disability to love yourself, do what you please, have a general fearlessness, and charm people? Do you think Machiavelli was suffering? Or Casanova? Or Robert Greene? Your lying to yourself. You wish our suffering to make yourself feel better Gretzel.

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  29. @Gretyl

    It's pretty much a more social than a phisiological diagnosis. Sociopaths don't want to become empaths, they seems content and they seem as miserable as any other human being (actually, less than often).

    A significant part of them can't even feel sadness. Does this sound like a disability? On wich basis? That feeling sadness is standard? Not from a naturalistic point of view.

    My pov is very similar to anon 12:52

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  30. I meant about harm and the need to adress this, not his/her take percentage.

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  32. I don't see the glamor in being a sociopath.
    Not glamorous to have those close to you decide it's better to walk away. How can you know who your allies are?

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  33. How can you know who your allies are?

    I would guess one would know their allies by being valuable for others, in a give and take fashion.

    Rather than exploitative.

    Just a guess :D

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  34. Interaction with my kind is inevitable. You have to take the good with the bad in people unfortunately, because that's the way nature works. In the end we all have strengths and weaknesses that level the playing field to where we all end up needing each other to function.
    Recently I read a article talking about children with sociopathic traits. They've found in some studies that identifying them early and channelling their traits towards more pro social goals helps them become more successful in life.
    I enjoy who I am, and frankly its not me being hurt so why should I care about what people think I should feel. I feel almost supernatural everyday like I'm the main star of a movie and all you muppets are supporting roles. When I get mad I just go fucking bananas for a brief period and its over. You people dwell on things and do passive agressive shit for days.
    You need people like me. My demons are terrible, but my angels are just as magnificent. People come with both. Psychopathy is not a disorder its a personality type that is rare since it holds leadership qualities. Its abuse of children born with these predispositions that makes them violent and antisocial. The focus should be giving parents proper education on raising children who have these predispositions, instead of ostracizing people who have unique gifts.

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  35. Finally I'm out. What have you guys been up to?

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  36. I'm not sure I even believe that sociopathy exists anymore. I almost think it is a label slapped on when nothing else applies and the person has low empathy.

    My theory is it is a bunch of other disorders. When a person lacks one of the defining characteristics of the disorder they have it becomes sociopathy. Extrovert scihzoid nope you are a socio. Schizophrenic without the hallucinations or maybe you just don't tell anyone about that part. Socio. Throw some malice into a person with BPD you get the picture. NPD?... That is just a step away as is anyways. Those are just the personality disorders. Then there are disorders like RAD, Bi-polar(Type-2), Emotional Detachment Disorder. Most of these are just one or two symptoms away from ASPD as is. So if the symptoms aren't being expressed or are just missed you get a wrong diagnosis. Or maybe you have two different disorders(They often run in pairs) and the expression of both equals ASPD.

    How many of us reveal any of our inner selves to people in real life? Even(or specially) with psychiatrists. I mean you only have to hit 3 of the criteria and none of the criteria would seem to far out of the other PDs.

    Ok so before the backlash to my idea I'd just like to say fuck you in advance. It is just an idea. It seems to me that even psychiatry wants a place to dump people, say they are evil, and then call them untreatable. This also would explain why they can't find a genetic or environmental link.

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  37. The way we're neurologically wired, and the way we think and what we think, and our pre-birth personality prints... all these are part of our personality.

    We cannot separate the way we think - the way we feel, how we react, the mindset we have and develop - from the concept of personality. They are the things our personalities are made of.

    The subject about how brains function is one I'm writing about these days. I expect to publish it in a couple of days.
    But I'm not sure that what I'm going to explain pertains to sociopaths. In fact, I'm very sure that it doesn't, because it's got to do with genetics, and sociopaths are the non-genetic variant where psychopaths are the genetic variant.

    That's why it sometimes is problematic to try and define both groups under one, for whereas we're so alike in many ways, in most of the aspects that have to do with behavior, the way we think and the kinds of "philosophies" we tend to gravitate toward, the likeness doesn't always continue once we get behind the brow.

    That said, I'm still of the opinion that we can learn also from details that don't exactly describe our own sub-category. For me it gives me a more complete understanding the more I know about the variations between our groups.


    Anon 8:09
    true, but the brain have endless memory.

    Not exactly. The brain may be able to store an enormous amount of memory, but it is only hypothetical and is only useful in theory.


    Anon 12:
    Psychopathy affects less than one percent of the population,

    Yes, but sociopaths are 3 times our number and that means we combined probably make up ca. 4% of the population.

    So you haven't met a sociopath, eh?
    Are you saying you're so law abiding you're just never present where a sociopath might be present? You're deluded, my friend! You may have met several sociopaths, and most like one or more psychopaths too.

    So how do you know you've never met any of us? Oh, or any sociopaths? Thought I'd best spell it out or I may be told you have met psychopaths, just not sociopaths, lol.

    Now you've virtually met representatives for both sociopaths and psychopaths, so your statement is no longer viable. ;)

    Don't worry, you'll find another sharp line in no time!
    - Nothing personal, we're used to nitpicking trolls around here. ;)

    Tell us what you meant?

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  38. Sociopathic children are like cats. They don't respond to punishment. They respond to rewards. How do you think a king would react if he was slapped by a peasant? This is what a sociopathic child feels like if hit by a parent. The grandiose personality starts early.

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  39. Anon
    Imo, the number is less than one percent, as i've yet to witness a sociopath first hand.

    If this is true, you must've lived your life in a closed box or in a cellar... or a prison cell? ;)

    No, your statement shows that you don't know how to spot a sociopath, and you most likely wouldn't be able to, because they can behave just as normal as you. The same goes for psychopaths.

    And this tells me you've become a victim of scary literature. Being afraid of something you haven't ever witnessed suggests what you read is faulty and not representative for what sociopath (or psychopaths) are like.

    I'm glad you wrote this, Anon. It backs a point I've been trying to make many, many times in debates and discussions with normal (neurotypical) people.
    - Dammit, I almost wish you'd written it on my website, it would've been an honor! But then, rather M.E. than Lovefraud or some other site of that nature, these people are frightened enough as it is.

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  41. Your not going to get a case by case study. The reality is we are walking around playing games right now. Luring people like you to our gingerbread houses.

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  43. what makes you think you're so desirable anyway? You don't sound like fun to me... I think you'll be fine sweety. "and other important characterists" hahaha, you're cute.

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  44. Why thank you Dr. Moreau, how wonderful that I won't have to drown my crypticpath in a bucket after all - it's so important to save water.

    Do please warn your carnivorous plants that he's become quite lofty of late, as I'd hate to see him devoured just because he's barking pompously to himself and snarling terms of 'endearment' for attention.

    Margarita-laced experiments sound just perfect for the old boy!

    And before you ask, yes, you're more than welcome to name him Soup Spoon.

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  46. We shall call him Grapefruit Spoon in deference to his serrated edge and vaguely archaic bark. 

    Potted to his neck in the greenhaus, He will, in profile, resemble Audrey and her seedling Tatoo who with honey trap and tendril lure the cottontails released at dusk in their enclosure.  

    Thus fed,  he will be muzzled and led to the study, to join the governess in her instruction of surrealist games (practice commences with the first cry of  DaDa and never really abates).

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  47. @Gretyl-- you don't think sociopaths are useful? We obviously need people who, even if they aren't sociopaths, are capable of putting aside empathy. Why not those who don't have it at all? Sure, you'd need to incentivize what you want them to do and be careful that they don't get bored, but people without empathy or guilt, provided they have the other requisite skills, could be very good at jobs society needs. It can't be easy to perform surgery calmly-- after all, the empathic brain wants you to shudder and look away as you involuntarily imagine the pain of a mangled hand or jutting tibia. We also need lawyers who can truly give the best defense for the worst person, without subconscious reservations sabotaging them without their knowledge. That's how an adversarial system needs to work. Jurors who consider a situation objectively, perceptions uncolored by the horror you might feel at a truly awful crime. People to deal with that crime close-up without freaking out on the job. Sure, empaths CAN do all those things, but I'd argue it's more difficult for them than for socios. And screw your options for "choosing" whether or not you "want" to deal with a certain kind of person. I'd rather not deal with idiots or people who drive like fools, the latter actually being physically dangerous, unlike most sociopaths, but I'm not going to go look for genes for such traits and try to institute a eugenics program against them. Suck it up, dealing with people you might not like is part of life. And honestly, who do you think is morally worse? Someone who's born unable to feel empathy, or someone who can feel empathy but chooses to turn it off as regards a certain population because you in your wisdom don't believe that they deserve it? The key word, of course, being "chooses." Certainly sociopaths choose their actions, but the factors entering into their choices are different from those entering into yours. Try using your empathy and quit playing Nazi.

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  50. Gretyl you are an idiot. Short sighted and incapable of actual thought. Alice has good points and does back up her point. You are just to lazy and thoughtless to understand what she says. Now go get stuck you portly pig whore.

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  51. Nicely stated Alice.

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