Monday, January 16, 2012

Portrait of a sociopath

I stumbled across this "self portrait" of a sociopath here, and thought it was one of the most accurate depictions of an everyday sociopath I've seen, and by that I mean it is the description of a sociopath that is the most similar to how I view myself:
I've often suspected I have sociopathic tendencies, but I don't fit all the criteria on your list.

I've lied and stolen from a very young age despite being brought up in a normal, loving, two-parent home. I had never been particularly loving until I learned consciously what the display of this behavior could do for me. In arguments with my sibling I was always labeled cold and unfeeling because I would turn off the outward expression of emotion to the point that I'm not sure I felt anything at all.

Despite this, I have forged some stable long-term relationships, married, and now have a daughter. I have learned to blend in with the status quo so much that I highly doubt if anyone suspects my inward nature. Once I learned consequence I stopped stealing and now only lie when it benefits me in some tangible manner and the risk of being outed is low. Despite this outward appearance of normalcy, I lack any sort of depth or substance. Emotions are often faked, and I have to work at performing regular friendship and relationship maintenance to keep these relationships going when there is no emotion behind the act whatsoever-(for instance, buying and providing a nice birthday card and gift for a long time friend with loving sentiments).

I struggle often with behaving appropriately and in a manner acceptable to society. I am still tempted to steal and have to slowly walk myself through the consequences of doing so. I don't avoid stealing by arguing the morality of it, but rather what would happen to me if I was caught. In my teen years I was promiscuous and to this day still struggle with my urges, though I have never cheated on my husband for fear of being caught. Sex and lust for me is more of a function of manipulation that it is a physical urge, though I can and have enjoyed sex.

I often fantasize about soulful, deep, searing love relationships but don't think I could ever truly experience this. I've used my looks and sexuality in the past to draw men in and after they fell I was through. I finally married after pressure from family, and conceived after 10 years due to pressure from my husband. I love my husband to the extent of what he can provide for me, financially and sexually, but I don't know what it means to have an aching heart for anybody real.

Nearly everything I do, even today, is calculated for personal gain. I am constantly weighing energy output VS gain VS acceptable behavior.

The only unfettered love I've experienced so far is for my daughter. She is the only one who I have *ever* given more to that I expected to receive in return, without calculating what my contribution will get for me.

I wish I wasn't like this, that I could feel a normal depth and range of emotion and not constantly be tempted by my urges. I really don't think anybody could help me, I think that my constant self-checking and chameleon lifestyle is really the best I can ever expect, I don't think a head shrink could provide me with any better "therapy". I some ways I think my disorder is a gift, because I am a consummate logician, being unfettered by normal depth of emotion.

I think there are probably many *many* people out there just like me, who live in a cloak of normalcy. I could be your neighbor, or even your wife. I firmly believe I was born this way and it is just how I am wired. I don't expect anyone to feel sorry for me but I wanted to give my own perspective on my APD.

I think I am more normal that anyone would care to admit, even to themselves.

284 comments:

  1. There are those who really do have something structurally different in there brains which gives them ASDP and those who've never had it diagnosed and just say that they are sociopaths (I'm not saying those two are synonyms so don't harass me on a technicality). My curiosity is in the question, how does a desire to change one's current character factor into the diagnosis of a sociopath. Recently most of the people you've had on here have expressed some desire to change the way they are. I guess what I'm trying to say is, is that a rational desire to be like other people or an emotional desire.

    -This is Draxious

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  2. This is not entirely your fault. See post entitled "Surrendering to the sociopath we created - our kids" at this location

    But recognition of your issue is really cool and I wish you the best on this. Would love to be kept updated on your progress.

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  3. It is food for thought. Can the true sociopath be able to say I am a sociopath and change what they are?
    My feeling is that those folks who say this are not as "sociopathic" (is that a word?) as some. So there is hope.

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  4. Your description of your world sounds like the view of most people in the finance industry. How "pathological" can you be if there are entire professions and industries of people who are in most ways just like you?

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  5. I would really like to challenge what you are putting out here lately, M.E., as far as who is a sociopath. I honestly don't see how a lot of these people you have been tossing onto here are sociopaths at all. Honestly, if you took the PCL-R and had a actual professional run it through based off of this do you think they would score high?

    Take for instance. This person has impulse control maximised. Never divorced. Never cheated on their spouse. Wants to steal, but doesn't (Which seems to be the biggest woopeedoo throughout the article). Doesn't lie..Unless it benefits them. Gives into the pressure from family to marry. Gives in to pressure from spouse to have kid. Stable career.

    The only thing that this person has that is out of the ordinary is:

    I would turn off the outward expression of emotion to the point that I'm not sure I felt anything at all.

    Which is the exact opposite of a sociopath. Sociopaths have a glow about them. That's the reason that people are so attached to them and believe everything they say. It's the conviction they have. It's not this dead pan straight faced bloke staring you down like in the movies. Sociopaths are the gleaming smiling faces that you just love to be around because it brings you up and in anger they are another extreme.

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  6. The fear of being outted is perpetuated by sites like this and Lovefraud.

    Sociopaths stand out, even when hidden. Those who are victims and predators alike can often sense something is wrong or off like a animal instinct. They'll return your courtisies but greatly distrust you from the get to.

    Sociopaths wanting to no longer be sociopaths is a crock of shit. At best, you'll get one trying to stay out of prison, or limit shitting where they eat.

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  7. ME
    I, humbly, bring Alterego to this equation. I would like to hear what she has to say because I think she is no longer a "sociopath", as per definition. I think she HAS sociopath traits, but her identity is not that of a sociopath.

    If I have spoken for you, again, Alterego, I am sorry. I was speaking from my perception of you. If you don't care for me to do this, again, let me know.

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  8. You want to be like others because you see the convenience and joy they get from those relationships. You've never experienced that, but you can see it. You know ways it would benefit you. This part is fairly logical.

    You want to be like others because your lack of an emotional connection with people is either seen or as you get more careful, something you need to upkeep no matter how much you don't want to. This part is somewhat emotional, because it is annoying and something you don't want to do but logically do.

    The world is not made for you. You are not socially acceptable. The few who are like you have annoying side effects or will never come out and say it. Even if they did what would you say to each other? There's not really any emotions to play off of or much to talk about. There's no particularly beneficial interaction between you two as individuals, and you've both spent your entire lives being conditioned to talk to everyone else.

    The reality is those who consider you a friend will deny/rationalize it with their own emotional experiences that you've never had. You can outright tell friends who consider you close various events or symptoms that should set off alarms in their head. It was practically a game to me to do so for a while, until it got boring and seemed pointless. If you go too far they will hate you for who you are, and if you don't go far enough it's annoying that they don't get it. And we all know what the average person thinks of the empathy deficient.

    I don't particularly like obligations, social or career you could say it's my nature to ignore them. That's entirely what this post was about. There's no good analogy to explain what it's like to bring yourself to fulfill obligations. It's getting there that is hard. Once you actually get yourself somewhere or doing something it's not too bad usually. It keeps you occupied and functioning within society.

    At the end of the day I like who I am. I really do. If I could magically gain empathy would I? It'd certainly be something new and interesting, and the temptation of "ignorance is bliss" is right there in front of me. If it were like an empathy-inducing drug that lasted for a few hours or something I'd be down, but anything permanent I'd pass.

    And as far as being outed, outside of worrying about a terrible lie impacting your wants it's not a big deal. If you aren't some out of control dickwad people can't "out" you for much. One or two events shouldn't be enough to bury you, and "baseless" accusations about your character, like he cares about nothing or I could see him being a serial killer, don't go very far.

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  9. @ Raven
    Saw your health issue on yesterdays posts. I wish you well x x

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  10. In my opinion, I don't have a "health issue". I'm done having babies. They can remove everything if they need to, and that will be the end of it.

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  11. This is what I have been going through and it relates to the article, somewhat.
    If you had a lot of trauma, you cannot "feel out" life. Wisdom can, only, be gained by having the ability to feel out what is happening within you and outside of you and to learn, accordingly. That is why children are wise.


    If anything blocks that process, you can go through many, many life experiences and never change.

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  12. The picture on the post looks like Elijah Wood.

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  13. "That is why children are wise"

    No. Wisdom requires emotional control and the ability to logically decipher perceptions of people, events, and situations. In no way are children wise, they have a lack of knowledge and logical processing in their brains to be thought of as wise. Your idea of wisdom is quite tainted.

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  14. Children see things as they are. This is a PART of wisdom, and a necessary part, but just a part. You are right, there.

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  15. "In my opinion, I don't have a 'health issue'"

    Thought you'd feel like that. Still: don't die. :|

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  16. Children see things without filters. But they lack the life experience to compare what's going on around them, to anything else, and therefor understand the mechanics. The most you can say is that their instincts are still sharp, because they haven't been taught to ignore them yet. That's not wisdom though.

    Wisdom
    1
    a : accumulated philosophic or scientific learning : knowledge b : ability to discern inner qualities and relationships : insight c : good sense : judgment d : generally accepted belief
    2
    : a wise attitude, belief, or course of action
    3
    : the teachings of the ancient wise men

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  17. not sure what the health issue is, but hope you feel better Raven

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  18. I don't have a health issue, Zoe. It's being taken care of soon. It's only a health issue when it hinders my ability to function.

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  19. A comment UKan made yesterday made me think about a friend of mine that points out all of my failures in logic when I think they are valid. We were hanging out having one of our many discussions that was about nothing and eventually led to crime. Not mine at first until I ended up attempting to explain to her guilt.

    The crime was assault, and she happened to be at the destination when I showed up after my hearing. I was found not guilty for self defense purposes, but she had this feeling that whatever went down had everything to do with me wanting to, and using self defense as an excuse. She always brings it up now, and keeps saying I was supposed to be guilty. In this discussion she did it again.

    I told her boldly and confident that I wasn't guilty. That asshole shouldn't have let a stranger that close to him, and that I wasn't caught for the crime, so I wasn't guilty. She sat up (because we were laying on the floor) and stared hard at me, asking me to repeat myself, and I said as confident as before, "You aren't guilty unless caught."

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  20. fear of being outed? that gives me more of a reason to do it, because i'm confidant even when caught in the act, that i'll manipulate my way out of the situation. this guy is another robopath, there's no arrogance in his character.

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  21. Part II:

    I remember her shaking her head, and groaning in sheer agitation, throwing a dramatic but humorous fit because she was bothered by what I said. I sat up and asked her what the issue was, and she said, "Just because you weren't caught doesn't mean you weren't guilty."

    Me:" Then how am I guilty if I was never caught from doing it?"

    Her: "Because it was something you weren't supposed to be doing in the first place. Just because you weren't caught doesn't mean you weren't guilty. It was an illegal act, period, and this is why you are guilty."

    Me: (after a LONG moment of silence, I smirked) "Oh......okay, I get it."

    The way I think I never see anything being guilty unless you are caught for the act. So when I was tried, and was released, I never saw it as being guilty. I guess I took it literal. With her though, she was abe to realise that guilt is guilt because it is something "we" are not supposed to be doing, and to break that law, or defy the rules, is what makes "us" guilty. It never registered that way to me, and only from her throwing her fit, and correcting me the way she did did I realise just how fuckin' stupid my comment was.

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  22. the dead pan facial expressions are often seen in aspies.

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  23. as a psychologist, ukan is the only person i've seen on her with a legit psychopathic outlook. probably david also.

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  24. I'm a psychologist too and I think making a diagnosis based on a comments posted on a website is reckless and irresponsible.

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  25. "making a diagnosis based on a comments posted on a website is reckless and irresponsible."

    THE GUILT IS EATING ME UP!

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  26. Everyone has urges to steal, control, abuse and take advantage like this individual, but the conscience quells those thoughts and urges from becoming actions.

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  27. Raven said...
    I don't have a health issue, Zoe. It's being taken care of soon. It's only a health issue when it hinders my ability to function.


    that's exactly how i feel

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  28. "as a psychologist, ukan is the only person i've seen on her with a legit psychopathic outlook. probably david also."

    lol, really... You must suck at being a psychologist then.

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  29. @8:47

    tossing in the kindling, anon?

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  30. i do worse things in a day than this girl has done in her lifetime.

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  31. "that's exactly how i feel"

    It's an huge ego thing with me. I'll admit to something being wrong one minute, then say it never happened the next. I've actually been lying to some people, telling them that the doctors didn't find anything wrong. lol

    I crack myself up!

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  32. diary of a socio (based on true events) --

    threatened mom for refusing my requests for money.
    smeared brother for not getting me a gift at christmas (i didn't get him one, but i still should have gotten one)
    beat my dog with a broom for barking.
    drank glass after glass of pepsi.

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  33. A loving heart is the beginning of all knowledge. - Thomas Carlyle.

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  34. I hate fags like that who try overly hard to be suave.

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  35. about the post...
    it's about self control i think. someone with psychopathic traits and low self control is gonna lash out and end up in prison. someone with self control can blend in almost perfectly with the general population.
    whether you want to include lack of self control as a critical part of psychopathy is up to you. it's one of the less interesting characteristics i think. of course, as it was based on the prison population, the PCL-r is heavily weighted to include lack of self control, most of the 2nd half of the questions being behavioural rather than thought-process.

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  36. @rescogitans

    lashing out does not mean a sociopath will go to prison. do abusers, bullies, parasites and control freaks in general, ever end up in prison? very very rarely does that happen.

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  37. sociopaths are not good people, we all know this. back in the day, a sociopath was simply branded as evil. when you aren't a good person, your character will reveal itself frequently.

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  38. "most of the 2nd half of the questions being behavioural rather than thought-process"

    And without the second half, an individual cannot require 30, or over.

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  39. sociopaths are marvelous people!!!! I LOVE them to pieces!!!!

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  40. Raven said...
    "that's exactly how i feel"

    It's an huge ego thing with me. I'll admit to something being wrong one minute, then say it never happened the next. I've actually been lying to some people, telling them that the doctors didn't find anything wrong. lol


    lol. i do too, depending. people don't need to know everything.

    i don't think it's ego with me. i just get obsessed with hobbies and work and will ignore injury or illness if it doesn't get in the way.

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  41. Psychopaths are nasty people. Shows like Dexter skew psychopathy.

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  42. psychopaths are marvelous people!!!!!! I LOVE psychopaths to pieces!!!!

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  43. Satan's CheerleaderJanuary 16, 2012 at 12:08 PM

    When will you people learn to love Satan and all of his children? When will you learn to lay with them and make babies with them? When will you learn to sacrifice bodies to them and drink blood with them? When will you learn that you were born to serve them? When will you learn that Satan has a plan for you just like God? He wants you to love what that which you put above yourself as you rightly should.

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  44. Sociopaths are capable people. Good or bad is insignificant.

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  45. mk, i'm a sociopath and i never do good deeds for others. i've proudly battered and controlled countless partners and never went to prison, or became detected. i testament this to my intelligence and being smooth. people do good things for me on a consistent basis, why do you think this happens?

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  46. anon, don't underestimate the power of 'accidentally' revealing a good deed. i used to leave a letter from a sponsored african kid out in my apt in such a position that it was kinda tucked away but still caught the eye of the girl i was bringing back...

    anon11.57
    that's my point, dumbass.

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  47. women get turned off by niceness, res. your doing it completely wrong. i'm a pompous smug bastard and they love me for it ;)

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  48. @BibleAnon: You did not in any way presume to speak for me, you merely asked to hear my perspective, and I will happily share it with you if it might somehow prove useful.

    Though I was diagnosed with ODD as a teen, I cannot be sure what would have happened to me if something had not arrested my downward spiral. I do not think that merely reading the Bible would have been sufficient, as I likely would have found all manner of perfectly "rational" reasons to reject it, were I merely engaging the content with my intellect. The fact is, I had a very profound, personal spiritual experience that changed my life forever. I have also witnessed God working in my life in spectacular ways that I cannot simply rationalize away or dismiss as coincidence. I don't expect my experiences to convince anyone else, but the fact is, they totally changed me.

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  49. someone with self control can blend in almost perfectly with the general population.

    That's because someone with self control is part of the general population you dunce. We are talking about sociopaths not nihilists.

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  50. when a person is down to earth everyone likes them. that's not what i'm about, i want winners admiring me.

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  51. lol of course, but you have to give them a hint now and then that they can change you ;)

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  52. The fact is, I had a very profound, personal spiritual experience that changed my life forever. I have also witnessed God working in my life in spectacular ways that I cannot simply rationalize away or dismiss as coincidence. I don't expect my experiences to convince anyone else, but the fact is, they totally changed me.

    You sound like one of those typical youth pastors and their annoying testimonies.

    I was saved from a life of sin!

    I used to see them on the corner as a lad. They would come up to us and tell us that they used to be out here causing mischief too. Then they found Jesus. Jesus was a tough guy too, blah blah blah blah. Relate relate relate, switch up, convert.

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  53. Raven, I should say it won't be significant to you as to whether or not the person cares about you. Relationships for sociopaths are an ownership thing.

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  54. @Res
    You got the rap down good LOL

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  55. This is what is heard to explain to people who never had an encounter with Jesus. It is not intellectual. It is not airy fairy or wimpy. It is as different as the first time you had an orgasm. Who can explain it :P

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  56. when a person is down to earth everyone likes them. that's not what i'm about, i want winners admiring me

    ha ha. Seriously.

    I fit into society perfectly, but it's not because I'm some law abiding citizen or control my impulses. My wife's old boss wanted to come over and pick my brain on how to run his business not knowing the business I run is totally illegal.

    I'm cocky about it. Here I am on the internet bragging about breaking laws and nobody can do anything. I love taunting the police. It's not enough for me to just make some money I have to dance on the edge of the cliff as well.

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  57. This is what is heard to explain to people who never had an encounter with Jesus. It is not intellectual.

    You can say that again.

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  58. "Raven, I should say it won't be significant to you as to whether or not the person cares about you. Relationships for sociopaths are an ownership thing."

    lol

    Yes, I know. But what brought this train of thought on?

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  59. I like to think Alterego is M.E's Mary Sue...

    "It's an (sic) huge ego thing with me. I'll admit to something being wrong one minute, then say it never happened the next."

    I'm even worse in this regard. I'm self-neglecting to the point of being self-destructive. I regularly forget to eat and sometimes just don't feel like eating even when I do think about it, I mostly ignore pain and sickness and--come to think about it--almost every kind of physical discomfort and I... well... that's about it, really.

    "drank glass after glass of pepsi."

    YOU MONSTER!

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  60. Fuck I scammed my parents out of money again today. Giving them bad feelings and sleepness nights, I'm typing this at a bar, the rose wine is jus 'ok', haha!

    I'll buy my mother a little flower when I visit them this weekend.

    Hiahahahhihih, riding the rollercoaster ...

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  61. "I scammed my parents out of money again."

    Your parents paid to have sex with you?! That's disgusting!

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  62. GEEZE Wheatley! That's fucked up. I don't neglect my needs, I'm just too prideful to admit I have a mortal human body. :p

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  63. I loved that comment Wheatley, whitty!

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  64. UKan Tauntus said..
    I'm cocky about it. Here I am on the internet bragging about breaking laws and nobody can do anything. I love taunting the police. It's not enough for me to just make some money I have to dance on the edge of the cliff as well.


    all the police would have to do is get your IP, track down the service provider, and demand that they turn over your identity. if they wanted to. my guess is they're focused on the pedophiles.

    also UKan, no offense, but your business sounds small time. it's not like you live in a mansion and fly around in your own personal jet.

    the police could do something, but apparently they just aren't interested. :)

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  65. You sound like one of those typical youth pastors and their annoying testimonies."

    Oh well. It happened to me, it DID change me, and that's that.

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  66. "Fuck I scammed my parents out of money again today."

    Spoiled children who have co-dependent parents, don't have to scam their parents, David. You probably just asked them for the money, and they said yes.

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  67. lol

    dat true Daveeed?

    vw: lazies

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  68. all the police would have to do is get your IP, track down the service provider, and demand that they turn over your identity. if they wanted to. my guess is they're focused on the pedophiles.

    Actually no. They would have to get a warrant, which means they would need to know my country of origin and have corrobarating evidence to compel the courts to get my ISP to give them who I am. Then they have to get past a proxy. I count on the fact that nobody would even believe what I'm saying is true. They don't give a toss enough and that's why I do it. Because I can get away with it.

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  69. @Raven
    You wrote;
    "Spoiled children who have co-dependent parents, don't have to scam their parents, David. You probably just asked them for the money, and they said yes."

    Can I buy you a drink?

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  70. I'll take a bourbon on the rocks.

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  71. You are so cool Ukan *rolleyes*

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  72. I have a freshly opened bottle of Chardonnay I'd be willing to split.


    Side note: I should have been a chef.

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  73. I think that since the poster doesnt really have problems with impulse control, she isnt really sociopathic. Shes just a woman. What she describes is pretty status quo. Marry a man for financial stability, have a rugrat, be a sheep. She feels numb because she is living an inauthentic life.

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  74. You are so cool Ukan *rolleyes*

    Ha ha ha. I love being cocky on here. You women despise it.

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  75. I think that since the poster doesnt really have problems with impulse control, she isnt really sociopathic. Shes just a woman. What she describes is pretty status quo. Marry a man for financial stability, have a rugrat, be a sheep. She feels numb because she is living an inauthentic life.

    Exactly. It's the ravings of a unhappily married woman who feels trapped in the family life nostalgic for the days of being a slut.

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  76. WELL WELL... Are you flirting with me by putting that quote up, M.E.?
    That's pretty cute... I must say. But only because I get to claim it now, instead of Monica! :p

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  77. You were making me think a lot about how my husband thinks, last night. Talking about it with someone else makes me sort of realize outwardly the way my husband is. And the way I am.

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  78. UKan said...
    Actually no. They would have to get a warrant, which means they would need to know my country of origin and have corrobarating evidence to compel the courts to get my ISP to give them who I am. Then they have to get past a proxy. I count on the fact that nobody would even believe what I'm saying is true. They don't give a toss enough and that's why I do it. Because I can get away with it.


    if they were to put you away there would be a long line of guys ready to instantly fill the space. going after you would be a waste of resources. it would change nothing.

    if you were taunting them with pedo stuff though, they would investigate.

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  79. Lol. Take That, monica, ME loves us more than You!

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  80. "You were making me think a lot about how my husband thinks, last night. Talking about it with someone else makes me sort of realize outwardly the way my husband is. And the way I am."

    And what conclusion have you come to?

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  81. Really zoe? I never thought of that. Thanks for filling me in~

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  82. Pedo stuff is actually also a waste of resources, but the public has higher demands onit so they tend to investigate that stuff and then they to jail for a year or two and get brought back into society... So much for public scrutiny.

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  83. Lol. Are we doing me now? Not so much conclusions anyway. It's nothing new, it's just staring at me. And you're a smart cookie, anyway.

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  84. "Lol. Are we doing me now?"

    Sure. Why not? I'd love to put you in the hot seat. But I'll have to mimic you to do it. Will that suffice?

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  85. @ Missus LOL
    Twitter War

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  86. Well, Missus, we need to start from Day One, today :)

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  87. New Rule--- Raven has to stop harrassing me by calling me Cow Tits.

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  88. I'm just too prideful to admit I have a mortal human body."

    Yes! Me too! Also, and I'm sure you feel the same: I am my brain, everything else is just an overly complicated power plant.

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  89. Well, what do you want to do Missus?

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  90. It was very interesting reading the exchange between you two last night, Raven & MK. This place can be downright interesting when the kids are in bed.

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  91. I feel the same way you do toward my body, wheat. In many ways I value resilience and self control, but i also don't tend to hear my body's signals like hunger, sex drive, exhaustion, etc. I tend to plow through such feelings and maintain control over my mind despite those needs... Like a challenge of mind over matter.

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  92. Anyway, Missus. I am here to learn and grow. I share because I have I place to do so, and I appreciate that. It is special when I get in to the Twitter, but what is more special is that I am changing.

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  93. Okay... This is me doing you (don't be dirty now) ;)

    What made you think you could make it work with a sociopath? Were you looking for someone strong enough to dominate you? Did you have a controlling parent you always submitted to? Do you think that you are too submissive to his demands, because you don't see you needs as important? Are you only this way with him? Are you a perfectionist?

    Okay... so I might have overshot on the quantity, but I got a little excited.

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  94. Sociopaths are a type. A label, if you will. People all fit very neatly into their labels. It's understanding how those labels effect them that's the challenging part. And moreso helping them to understand it. I believe in that. The world is broadened by understanding and education.

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  95. New Rule--- Raven has to stop harrassing me by calling me Cow Tits."

    You don't get to make the rules.

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  96. Well, forget about the Twitter stuff. I am here because this is one of the rare places you can talk about the kinds of things we do. The rest of what goes on, here, such as the fighting etc, means little to me.

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  98. Lol. I thought the exact same thing. The audacity?! Since when does monica make decisions, rules, regulations, or guidelines? She couldn't even stick to the timeliness she set for more than a comment. But she must have felt brave typing it.

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  99. money won't buy me happiness, but i'd rather cry in a mansion.

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  101. Lol. Nice.
    I have aspirations at being unique. I knew I nderstood him better than most, and i was waiting to find the purpose or use for that trait in myself. I'd been using it on people who weren't worthwhile before, so he seemed a perfect fit to my values and skills. Plus, for some crazy reason I always wanted to marry a drug dealer, and I believe people get what they always want.
    I had dated men who I easily could take control over, and i hated feeling like such a man so yes.
    My father was fairly controlling, though in my teens I stopped submitting to him. PLUS, he's changed dramatically now. He's the polar opposite of what he was, but still the same man. It's been amazing to watch him grow and maneuver his traits.
    I think i am too submissive to my needs in general, but my husband tends to be more accommodating to my needs than I am. In general I feel I have to more carefully discover my needs.
    I am a perfectionist. I set very high standards for myself, and i become discouraged when I discover I'm not perfect. I struggle with allowing my human side to come out.

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  102. MK you sound like a beeper.

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  103. Okay... I have to tease you on this one, young lady. You always wanted to marry a drug dealer?

    Maybe it's just that I've been around drugs and drug dealers my whole life but... that sounds a bit off to me.

    Like, I can understand you saying you always wanted to marry a gangster, or a sniper... but a drug dealer? That could be any kind of person. I would think that would be a junkie's wet dream, but just the title 'drug dealer' on its own, doesn't necessarily suggest power.

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  104. Lol. I'm a small town girl. My picture of the drug dealer was like the guy from The punisher. Not the losers idiot drug dealers trying to get their friends high. That's actually how I ended up dating my losers shaman ex. He tried to portray himself as the drug dealer, and i was too young to know any different. Then I met my husband through him, so i traded up for the real thing.
    I don't know what my attraction is. The illegitimacy. Nonchalance. Carfree disregard for authority. I'm not sure cause individually I'm not impressed by drug dealer traits, but in my husband he's like the movie stereotype, but not the gangster silly girl stereotype most people want and think of. I guess it's just my thing.
    I think people plan their lives when they're young and what lessons they'll learn for themselves.

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  105. Themes For Sw RegularsJanuary 16, 2012 at 3:14 PM

    Missus Kanney Theme Song

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ji2ma2mfyhU

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  106. "I think people plan their lives when they're young and what lessons they'll learn for themselves"

    I didn't.

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  107. Perfectionist, dominating father, tends to control a man if he's not dominant enough, submissive to her man but assertive/aggressive otherwise, drawn to bad boys - thats beeper talk.

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  108. UKandle said...
    Really zoe? I never thought of that. Thanks for filling me in~


    you're welcome. ha.

    okay i just have to ask. why do you boast? what does it do for you? it adds nothing to my impression of you and only takes away. it makes you look smaller. you seem intelligent and i enjoy reading your posts even if i rarely agree with them. but you're swaggering way of posting only undermines the thought put into them.

    your attitude makes you look like a simple nickel-and-dime man. and it makes me doubt both the success of your business and the existence of your possessions, in particular the wifely one. :)

    yet i detect an intelligence at work behind your words. what gives? are you real, or some writer's fanciful creation UKan? maybe MK's?

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  109. "I didn't."

    me either! i never had plans, or goals i wanted to acquire. when the teachers asked me what i wanted to be as an adult, i was the only person without an answer, because i really thought i could become anything i wanted. i couldn't put myself in a box. i lived in a fantasy world my whole childhood and teens and never developed bonds.

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  110. "I didn't"

    Me neither. I still don't know what I'll end up being...

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  111. @Ukan

    Why place so much value on an extreme lack of impulse control? Why do you think that someone who lacks empathy would not somehow grow to handle themselves a bit better as they grow up?

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  112. Impulse control is a hallmark of the cluster b's. Without it, there really is no "disorder".

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  113. A socio that gets coerced into marriage LOL. It gets better every day. She seems like the victim of a sociopath, if anything.

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  114. Lack of impulse control*

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  115. "I didn't"
    I didn't either, consciously, but somehow I ended up everywhere I imagined. I get crazy when it comes to stuff like this, but I think the closer we are to childhood the closer we are to our spiritual selves and the farther we are from our worldly selves, so in that "spiritual" time we plan the lessons we'll learn by the things we understand about the world then. But it's all a symbolism thing, too, so none of that is quite literal.

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  116. Next Round:

    Mk, it has been mentioned here before, that you are bisexual. But somehow I don't get that vibe from you At all.

    Why do you think you're bi? Is it just a fantasy? Have you been in a relationship with a woman? Ever been with a woman without a male present? Have you brought women home for the hubby and you to play with? Ever been in love with a woman?

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  117. Who was coerced into marriage? I coerced him, if anything. He's very much as trapped as I am. We're both stuck by how in love we are. That's why we, I don't know, got married.

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  118. I'd say sexually, women are as attractive to me as men are, but when it comes to sexuality I don't tend to be aware of many of my desires. But I'm not emotionally attracted to women. They tend to be too feminine, and I get overwhelmed by all the emotions they have. So it's hard to find women my type. My husband doesn't want to include other women in our relationship, though I've suggested it. I like to be hit on, and taken over sexually, so I'm open to either sexes, as long as they're manly, I guess. The first person I kissed and was open with sexually, if you could say that, was a girl, but otherwise I haven't gone too far into my experimentation. I'm sexually repressed, in general. I think I have innocence associated with sex with women.

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  119. I'm referring to today's post.

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  120. Oh, and yes Haven: I've seriously never seen Star Wars. But, honestly, I really don't see why I should.

    I haven't seen it, but I know Darth Vader turns out to be Luke Skywalker's dad; princess Leia turns out to be Luke's sister or cousin or something and that it's set in a weird alternate Universe in which parsecs are measurement of time, not distance; asteroid belts are filled to the brim with asteroids which presumably don't turn into actual planets because of magic; and the vacuum of space has been replaced with some kind of ether which enables people to hear spaceships and see laser beams from the side.

    And the speed of light is significantly lower than in our Universe, as evidenced by people having enough time to dodge/deflect laser beams when they're being shot at from 20 feet away. So apparently, light in the Star Wars Universe moves slower than bullets do in our Universe.

    Okay, now I'm just being a douche. I know it's science fiction. But what I mean by all this is that I know the movies pretty well, even without having seen them. Even some of the ridiculous stuff, like Han Solo saying "parsecs" because that particular route (I think it was called the "Kessler Run" or something) involved lots of black holes, and Han, with his Millennium Falcon, was able to fly closer to those black holes, meaning he could do it while flying a shorter distance. I even know what medichlorians are for fuck's sake.

    *huff huff*

    I'm just not in a hurry to watch them, you understand?

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  121. Sexually repressed?

    How interesting. I don't think I could handle that. I'd definitely make it my mission to pull every hair of your sexuality out from the roots, by the fistful.

    Why do you think you repress your sexuality? Were you molested? Or did you grow up in a family that was hush hush, about sex? Did you not explore yourself through masturbation enough? When did you lose your virginity?

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  122. I forgot: I've also never kissed a girl and I'm afraid the two might be mutually inexclusive.~

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  123. BTW Cow Tits, you're incapable of learning anything new. You're in a coma, and this is all just dream that will never end or change.

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  124. Zoe I have never gave a toss about your impression of me at least not in a psoitive way. In fact when I first came here I didn't say anything about myself for close to a year. Instead I challenged peoples thinking and played games with them. In fact I never said what I did for a living until luke came in with his fake drug dealer stories six months ago. If I wanted to impress you I wouldn't wait close to three years and only leave you with a vague idea.

    I like to boast about my crimes because I like to piss people like you off. It worked. Cheers.

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  125. @anonymous 4:03

    How do you describe someone like BTK then? Or really, any of the skilled serial killers who are psychopaths without dispute that lead normal lives. Do you not think it takes impulse control, or some ability to avoid being impulsive, to fit in and avoid being caught like they did?

    What do you define as impulse control?

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  126. Anyway; I'm off to bed. La'erz.

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  127. Fail. When BTK wasn't out there hanging nine year old's, he was brutalizing his local community members for tiny offenses. Read a biography on him. Impulsiveness doesn't always mean reckless, a sociopaths impulsiveness is focused.

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  128. Mhm, people with aspergers have lack of empathy. Sociopaths are extreme combinations of lack of empathy, poor impulse control, no conscience, and obsession with power. I'd say impulses get better with age but what I consider better I'm sure is not what most would consider a functional part of society at all. I mean I think I have pretty good impulse control in comparison with my youth, but I make a living selling drugs and just two weeks ago I was rushing off duty police officers drunk as hell with a knife. I seem normal to most people, but if you hang around me all the time you will see me do some crazy shit. All of my close friends tell me im insane but the people that don't know me well would say I'm one of the nicest people they've met.

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  129. @anonymous

    We have different definitions of impulsive, then. He wasn't very impulsive in his day to day life. I guarantee you he avoided impulse regularly when dealing with his community, most of his work, and family.

    I'm well aware of how he behaved as an animal control officer, and the killing part is obvious. I wouldn't consider either acting on impulse, given that both were calculated to some degree. He didn't suddenly do something, and that's part of how he avoided getting caught in the first place.

    He managed to harass some woman in to moving out of her house while not getting reprimanded. As an animal control officer. There's not many things hilarious in this world, but when I was watching a documentary and they interviewed that woman I laughed.

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  130. Aha, now we're getting deep.
    My parents were quiet about sex, but not repressive. Just evasive, I guess. I was 16 when I lost my virginity. I had a hard time with self exploration, and typically ended up frustrated.

    I like the idea of someone else exploring my sexuality for me... pulling it out of me, in a way. I always responded well to things I wash pushed to try, though they made me nervous at first. I'm very shy, but open minded, I suppose.

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  131. As well as sociopathy and psychopathy, there's reactive attachment disorder (RAD). Supposedly the untreated RAD child becomes flagrantly antisocial and grows into the adult sociopath or psychopath. I don't think this happens every time, though. I think the outcome may sometimes be a perfectly functional but very calculating, distanced, glacially independent adult who doesn't do commitment...or who at least watches the cost/benefit ratio as closely as you do. That's not evil. It's a viable way to go through th world.

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  132. "Rader lived for his so called motel parties. According to his journals, he'd drive out of town, check into a room and spend hours alone, fondling the belongings of his victims, dressing up in their clothes, wearing wigs and masks he'd be prettied up with lipstick and mascara, then binding himself in ropes and tying plastic bags over his head. Sometimes he'd cover the bed with scantily clad barbie dolls, set up his camera on a tripod, and squat down beside the dolls. He'd position the camera far enough away so that when the shutter snapped he seemed to be the same size as the dolls--all of which he imagined were his real life victims. It didn't get any better than that as far as he was concerned, because the barbie doll was the symbol of the perfect female."

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  133. "I like the idea of someone else exploring my sexuality for me... pulling it out of me, in a way."

    Well then... I guess it's too bad your husband doesn't want other women to be with you. lol

    Were your parents stuffy about other things too? Like worldly shit? What was the communication like in the family? Open or closed? Would you say your parents are warm and openly loving?

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  134. Rader was a darkly hilarious guy. You should get his bio.

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  136. I actually had a very loving family. They're not overt, but they're not stuffy by any stretch. Now I'd call my father and mother almost too open. Very gossipy. And my mother and I were always very very close. She tried to be approachable in general, but I'd say she was not open about sex. She is now, but I think she was uncomfortable to approach me, and it made the adverse even more true.

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  137. Who the fuck is Snowflake, Mk? Where do you use that profile at, eh?

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  138. Craigslist? I didn't know you could link a Blogger account to Craigslist.

    How does that work exactly? :D

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  139. Did you grow up poor? Middle class? Upper?

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  140. Lol. Alright, now I'm playing evasive.
    ME is fucking with you, Monica. That or ME is Monica, and I'm even more amused!

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  141. Actually I don't mind threesomes. I just don't want an open relationship. I'm possessive.

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  142. Um, My grandmother is upper, my family was poor, so sort of a mix between the two.

    wv rewifed. :D

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  143. Would you say you had a happy childhood? Good education? All your basic needs met? Was your life really dull before you met UKan?

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  144. "Actually I don't mind threesomes. I just don't want an open relationship. I'm possessive."

    How very typical. :P

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  145. That's why he picked tthe Missus. Shy in her sexuality, he knows she wont stray, but will do every ddepraved act he requires of her to keep him faithful. But she dont know what goes on when he aint home... the perks of being a drug dealer.

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  146. My life was happy. And easy. And still is after I met Ukan. I have a pretty enjoyable and content standard of living. I only get bored when I run out of people to figure out. I wouldn't call my life dull, I'd call it enlightening, and that's my goal. Enculturation was challenging because it was almost too enlightening, but I'm working that out.

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  147. And I had a great education. In my home schools and now. I could have been more challenged, but I was lazy, and so I've developed bad homework habits, but all in all my education was exceptional.

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  148. by home schools I meant home town schools.

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  149. Is it sure that i won't stray because I'm shy? Or that he will because he isn't?

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  150. I think I'm done with my interrogation for now. My recommendation is for you to open your sexual mind up, little by little. From where you've started, there is so much road to travel.

    Must be nice.

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  151. Missus, Raven, what is repression to you guys. I think in a way I am sexually repressed, only I don't understand the term repression. I figure it includes a serious emotional barrier ceasing one from acting on what they desire, but I don't exactly struggle from that yet not being satisfied sexually.

    Yes, I just bo-guarded your convo and possibly turned this into an "Ask Abbey" column. My bad.

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  152. It's one of most focal aspirations currently. It's what causes me the most issues in my level of balance, so I'm trying slowly but surely to open up.And I'd call it daunting more than nice, but hopefully I'll get to nice.

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  153. i am going to pakistan on a pilgrimage

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  154. Nonsense, Mk. You're married happily, to the man of your dreams. How can exploring your sexuality with him be daunting? Nearly 3 yrs in, I'd think you'd trust yourself with him enough to open up.

    Tell me a fantasy you have never explored. Doesn't have to be kinky. Just something most people wouldn't hold back on, that You happen to.

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  155. Ha! I think not.
    Besides, I literally don't have any fantasies. And the ones starting to pop out in my mind aren't exactly PG.
    Want to know something sad? I saw my first ever pornographic video the other day?

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  156. My fantasies were all intimate when I was younger. Romance movie type with a makeout scene and cut to aftermath. Now they're things that literally shock me. Things I find it hard to fathom I can even think of.

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  157. Is that sad? I wouldn't know. Not having fantasies sounds a bit unusual. But then you say "starting to pop in my mind"... did something surface just now? I can can assure you, there is no such thing as PG sex. :)

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  158. Haha.
    When I do think of things, they're fleeting, far between, and few.

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  159. Maybe porn will be a good start for you then. It usually is.

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  160. It scares me a bit. The things I see in videos that are a turn on aren't a side of myself I'd like to release, I guess. Like I'm going to run off and start hosting fetish parties or something. It's a lifestyle I'm not interested in pursuing.

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  161. You can also start e mailing me if you like. I can open you up. I have a knack for that. As you already know. But you'll have to get your husband's permission. Of course...

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  162. Silly. You should be watching porn for couples. Not fetish crap! It more sensual.

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  163. Lol. I guess It's a floodgate I'm daunted by opening.

    I'll have to consider it. And thank you for the offer. You must enjoy that kind of thing.

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  164. There are types of porn? Lol.
    Seriously I'm like a 16 yr old when it comes to this stuff.

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  165. I enjoy it when it's a challenge. Doesn't everyone? ;)

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  166. You should check out some Max Hardcore. Great for beginners.

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  167. Max Hardcore? Is that a person, or a genre?
    And is that facetious?

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  168. UKanned said...
    I like to boast about my crimes because I like to piss people like you off. It worked. Cheers.


    i assure you it didn't. my point is that just a hint of drug dealing would have gone a lot further. you work too hard at it.

    it reminds me of an old colleague who managed to weave her title into almost every sentence during one meeting, making it painfully obvious how ill at ease she was with the role.

    is it really boasting, or are you assuring yourself? maybe it bothers you on some level that what you're doing is illegal?

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  169. Zoe, your idiocy never ceases to surprise me. I mean, with people like Demon you expect it, but every once in a while I forget you're there, and then you come back in and say something stammeringly ignorant. It's so much better from the standpoint of entertainment value.

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  170. Ya know, I may actually have to start making it a point to read your comments. You're much better than the Monica/Caroline.

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  171. Um, no zoe. You are way off. And I'm not mk either. You are sounding as idiotic as david.

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  172. Oh my. Am I missing porn debates? I have to be honest, I've never been into porn. I'd much rather be doing than watching. And any porn I've seen has been rather tame compared to my actual sex life.

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  173. Lol. I'm not sure we're debating. But surely the borderlines have lots of colour to add to the conversation. :D

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  174. Haha. Sex should be non stop fun and experimentation as far as I'm concerned. I really have few boundaries and the ones I do have are up for debate. I love exploring what turns my lovers on and gets them off. This may be a particular fascination of mine, but for someone that desires tangible evidence of affection rendered, especially with male lovers, it's fun to see what results are inspired, no matter the fetish or desire.

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  175. Does it bother you that I'm propositioning your wife, UKan?

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  176. Idk about UKan, but I"m a little jealous Raven.

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  177. You're particularly feminine, that way, haven.

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  178. It's funny with me. I like to know that I please my partner, but for me there's a large element of control I have over their pleasure. With men it's easy to see the result, which is something I greatly desire, with women not so much, though they have so many of their own benefits.

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  179. In many ways I abhor being female, in others though... I rather revel in it. Being genderfluid and completely open in my sexuality is something incredibly freeing.

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  180. @UKan

    being way off and being idiotic are two different worlds. and.. just lol.

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  181. No. Because she wont email you.

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  182. Not for you zoe. They are just part and parcel

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  183. "No. Because she wont email you."

    LOL well there you have it, Mk. Your decision has been made. :D

    @Haven

    What are you up to this evening?

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  184. Won't I? Is that an allowance you won't make or a prediction?

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  185. Heehee. Hi Raven =) I just made a big dinner (beef tenderloin with shallot and parsley butter, rustic balsamic caramelized onion tri-cheese tart and roasted asparagus) for Tech Boy the Roommate and her bf. We had wine watched movies and whatnot. And now I"m winding down before an early day in the morning. What does your evening hold?

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