Wednesday, December 10, 2014

Enabling? or promoting understanding?

From a reader:

Your book's been a beacon I've given up searching for. It's really fascinating, to finally have the words to identify these abstract ideas I've had about myself for so, so many years. It's helped me organize certain behavioral traits which allowed me to organize my thoughts and my behavior more efficiently. There's a story behind all of this, but I would ultimately want you to know that your work and the numerous sources you've referenced have helped me understand myself. It was liberating. The fact that I can recognize my sociopathic traits has allowed me to release these limits I've placed upon myself in order to prevent any damage that may have gotten me noticed in a way that wouldn't suit my interests. 

Perhaps what your work has done most to impact my understanding of this condition is that I'm not the monster that the media has brainwashed people into thinking. And even if I am; that isn't all I have the capacity to be. I'm so much more.

So for all of what I've mentioned, you have my thanks.

Patrick O.

M.E.: I wonder, how would you respond to critics who might say that the book is bad because it empowers sociopathic individuals to embrace their evil behavior rather than fighting it?

The reader's response:

To answer your question,
This book isn't meant to treat or cure anything. What it does is it promotes a degree of self-awareness and provides information that enables the reader to make an informed decision of how to address this particular condition. Knowledge is power and by that idea alone, may correlate to how the book may empower an individual. However; to say it will certainly strengthen the evil and malicious intent of the individual is completely false. Sociopaths are people who simply view the world differently due to their psychological make-up. To me, it seems like such a dark declaration would translate to antagonizing a sociopathic individual for understanding why they have a harder time crying at a funeral than others. It's preposterous. I've done volunteer work at a hospital of my own accord without any incentives, donated to charities, and engaged in what many people I associate with (the majority empaths) would recognize as random acts of kindness. Whether or not I express humility or feel closer to being a saint won't change the fact that my actions were altruistic and ultimately benefited the lives of many others around me. That being said, some may be callous, others may be assertive, but that does not render the sociopathic individual incapable of having integrity and possessing the qualities needed to live in a much more empathetic world. The book did not make me a sinister individual or upset whatever spiritual balance of good and evil emotionally attuned people would be receptive to. It helped me recognize certain characteristics I possessed that damaged relationships that I made a conscious decision to return to and successfully repair. Finally, sociopaths have just as much of a choice to do good as empaths. So reading a book can do as much good to the individual as that person will allow.

Personal Note:
From my understanding of your question, I believe it stems from those numerous studies of sociopaths in the prison system that critics may have gone through before approaching your book. I believe what you're doing through it is a necessary step despite whatever condemnation your work may face. You're very wise to have chosen an alias for yourself considering how steep this uphill journey you're progressing through is; so I commend your foresight. It's a real shame that it may be quite quite some time until your interpretation of socipathy is accepted in the general populace, but until then, it seems assimilation will still be the ideal method of living in this world. You have a good day M.E.

86 comments:

  1. Whenever someone tells me something's bad because it might give preference to evil over good actions/thoughts/whatever, I'd ask for a definition of "bad" and "evil" and wouldn't accept the answers
    "because god/higher being/aliens from outer space told us",
    "because it is" or
    "it has bad consequences for you(/person X/generally)".

    Especially the latter argument bothers me; How would they know how I feel about the consequences? They wouldn't and most likely they can't since I'm the only one able to determine whether I find something at some given point of time to be bad or good for me.

    Moreover, for a damaged mind everything can become a trigger of inappropriate behaviour, be it this book, a butterfly or someone pointing out you're evil. Negative behaviour is a symptom, not the cause, if you ask me.

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    1. Hi Nihilistic Mind, as you said yesterday, I've followed your tip, I've found a victim, and I talked with her pretending that I like what she like's. I think she like's me , What now???


      abc

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    2. You think she likes you? How do you know? Did she tell you?

      Also, for more tips I told you I charge 10$ per vowel, though I contemplate giving you a free-of-charge-version, vowels excluded of course.

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    3. she gave'd me her number after some talking, also she said we could hang out sometimes, so what do you think?? as I said '' always tell them what they wanna hear'' right ?


      abc

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    4. What I think? Well, if she'd gave me her number I'd go on and bang her.

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    5. There's a certain magic to this Anon's idiocy.

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    6. Baron, I thought the same. I'm somehow fascinated by this person.

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    7. damn I get all emotional now

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  2. Sociopaths and empaths are going to receive ME's text differently. The thought pattern of an empath is to have a feeling and then collect observable data to justify their feelings, whereas a sociopath identifies a target/goal and then manipulates the observable data to reach it.

    Empath Feels: sociopaths are bad and dangerous
    Empath Response to Text: see all the negative traits reinforced here? The end is nigh!

    Sociopathic Goal: To further refine understanding of psychopathy through first-hand account.
    Socio Response to Text: That matches 40% of my experience. The writing is solid and the mask is a cute homage to Mask of Sanity. I wonder if I could manipulate ME?

    It is what it is. It was a good book and unique in the field. Empaths will cry of course, but being soggy makes them easier to digest.

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    1. "being soggy makes them easier to digest." LOL!

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    2. HLHaller, what can I say... Woke up with a lower-than-average threshold for ridiculous nonsense. "Empaths don't like a book that talks candidly about sociopathy." No shit. The whole subject, our very existence, makes them uncomfortable. A first-person account of a successful one makes them pee a little. Moving on.

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    3. glad you all got empaths figured out!

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    4. "being soggy makes them easier to digest." like a snake does

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    5. CC, you're pretty insightful, but you've got to remember that 96% of humanity can't be identical and react and think identically. (And if you have trouble understanding that, you might want to check your grandiosity, because it's making your thinking weak.)

      I think it's really important for more people like M.E., and y'all here, to speak up, and for all of us to learn about and understand sociopathy. The problem isn't that all empaths are timid or stupid or terrified, but most of us are pretty misinformed about sociopathy. It's just not something that's been explored and discussed the way it needs to be, and thank you to M.E. for contributing to changing that.

      When I talk with my friends about what I'm learning here, they're initially repulsed and angry (the usual response to sociopaths, understandable since most of us have been hurt by them more than once, often pretty badly). But as the conversation goes along they begin to be interested and more objective and want to learn more.

      There is a certain revulsion, I have to admit it. I don't understand it fully; I wonder if it's automatic, like some peoples' reaction to snakes or spiders.

      But it only makes the whole subject more intriguing.

      Also--"soggy" cracked me up and inspired my posting-name. Ha!

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  3. For me the book also provided better understanding of some of my thinking processes. But it also made me understand that not everyone thinks like this. Seeing this difference gave me certain peace — like a shift in perspective.

    One of my very first thoughts was that "OK, I'm going to become the best sociopath possible". For me that means enhancing the useful qualities and perhaps reducing ways to behave that cause damage and chaos.

    Right now I'm in the middle of a work-related mess. I took a risk and figured that a possible outcome would be greater than those relationships that I would sabotage trying to achieve my goal. Unfortunately I didn't achieve what I wanted. This resulted in a few unrecoverable relationships and possibly some negative talk behind my back. Emotionally I am OK with that and it is easy to move on but on a long-term this kind of result is no good because it just makes my life more difficult.

    It seems like I will now "act good" and do some damage control by putting up a good facade to prevent further damage. I could have avoided this but then I could have achieved what I was after too – it was a risk that I took.

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    1. “It seems like I will now "act good" and do some damage control by putting up a good facade to prevent further damage.” Yes. Do that, meanwhile I …. Hahahaha!!!!

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  4. I've been mulling this over a bit the last day or so - not sure it's fully formulated, but, here's what I've been thinking so far:

    I keep bumping back into the problem with the definitions of psychopathy and sociopathy. The whole conversation really does harken to debates around pornography the way I see it.

    To start, I took a look at the Wikipedia entry for psychopathy and I noticed the following link:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_psychopathy

    Reading over that, not that Wikipedia is an authoritative voice, it seems fairly clear that both terms are, at best, highly context dependent.

    One of the things that I was struck by is how Cleckley and Hare both attempted to solidify it by looking at in-patient and prison populations - after all, those are the people they were setting out to describe more precisely. So far, so good.

    So Hare, like Cleckley before him, made a list of things that he and others thought described those populations. Just to make sure, they validated the tool to make sure that everyone "measured" the same thing. It works - everyone gets the same answer! Cool! (If I understand the history correctly, this actually was a big deal in a notoriously inconsistent field).

    "What else can we measure with it?" So they start looking at the population at large - this still makes sense to me, but here's where things get dicey for me -

    What are they measuring? This might have been considered a bit more deeply to avoid some of the confusion we are coping with now. I mean, if this tool is to measure how "psychopathic" an individual is we still need a solid definition of the thing being measured. As it stands now, the closest thing we have to a "definition" of "psychopathy" is what is on Hare's list.

    The PCL-R is a tool of correlation, not causation and as such, it conflates a number of cognitive processes with dangerous behaviors, criminal behaviors (which aren't always predatory), and amoral behaviors (which also have some definition problems as well being as religion comes into that conversation almost without exception).

    It sure looks to me that term "psychopathy" is the new "pornography" - you can't really define it, but people know it when they see it.

    I do think that overall, the checklists have advanced the conversation by giving more consideration to how we process empathy and altruism and the like. However, they have also conflated some "conditions" with criminality and then media amplified those traits and stoked the fear.

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    1. I see M. E.'s book as bringing this conversation to a much wider audience. Will some people use it to justify "bad" behavior? Sure. But on balance, I think the conversation needs to continue and broaden.

      That's my not very humble opinion, anyway. 8)~

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  5. Everything in life is a combination of "luck" and risk avoidence.
    For example in WW2, some soldiers were killed, disembarking from the boat,
    and other soldiers survived harrowing battles over a four year period.
    Another way of saying it is: "When your number's up, it's up." Some Cancer
    paitents get "spontanious remission" and some die very quickly. If you are in the
    wrong place at the wrong time, it's over.
    For example, there is no sensable reason why Colleen Ritzer was murdered in
    the time and place she met her death. Sure, we know WHY the bathroom was
    chosen as the place of her death, just as we know why bathrooms are chosen
    to attack other people like the other teacher in the U.A.E. or a high school
    althelete who was attacked on a Saturday spontaniously by a group of janitors,
    (She went into the bathroom and soon muffled screams were heard.) But there's
    no reason why I have walked through high crime areas unnoticed and why people have been attacked and killed in supposedly "safe" areas, like their own
    homes.
    Why did God make such a dangerous world? So we would be concerned about
    the welfare of loved one's. The fact we could lose something helps us to value it
    more. And when we DO lose it, sympathetic loved one's pitch in to help us more.
    There's more to life then what we see in the material world.
    No, Colleen is NOT in Heaven now. Her body is in Sheo,-"The place of the dead
    or the unseen," a graveyard, another words, but she will be raised up as a 24
    year old woman at the conclusion of Christ's 1,000 year reign. She will be
    judged and then gain eternal life. Her murderer Philip Chism, will be there too.
    And if he accepts Jesus Christ as his personal savior in the time he has left on
    earth, he is absolved of judgement, and might actually make it into Heaven
    prior to Colleen!

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  6. I personally don't believe in evil, I kinda believe it but not in the usual way, shit this is confusing, and I don't think for myself that I'm a bad person, I do good things too, if they benefit me , also I didn't find the book very helpful, sorry M.E


    abc

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    1. So you're not a bad person, but want to ruin someone's life? I find that interestingly paradoxical.

      What would have to happen in order to consider yourself a bad person?

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    2. well I don't really know, for example if a husband murders his wife I don't see him as ''evil'', he must have his reasons like all of us, but some people may seen him as an evil/psychopath person. Also I consciously know that some of my actions may be selfish and ''evil'' for some people, but it doesn't bothers me, I know they are people who think like this to, I'm not the only one. and I do care for people to, for example my family, I need their money for now

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    3. How old are you? You seem to be kinda young. I'm 19 years old.

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    4. no shit Sherlock, I bet you figured out from '' I need their money for now'' thing, I'm 20 years old, wanna be friends now??


      abc

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    5. Watson, you shouldn't miss out on all the smaller clues.

      Of course I want to be friends, especially because of those double questionmarks.

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    6. oh man, I don't know what to say, I mean you look like a nice guy, but you are a sociopath, right? and I'm not


      abc

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    7. Thank you for the kind words, dear. I really like you, and you needn't be afraid of me. I'm not going to intentionally harm you or anyone if there's no reason to it.
      It's quite possible I'm a psychopath since the all the stuff that makes me different seems to be inherently there the more I investigate. We still could be bestest friends ever for today and see how it'll work out, k?

      Though you really need a name, man. That abc is cute but it's just not the same.

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    8. I don't know if your words ring true, I mean yeah we could be friends, but as you said you are a socio and I could never fully trust you. but we could try,I've never been to Austria



      Abc

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    9. Blind trust is overrated, just tell me straightforward if I do something you can't stand and I'll fix my behaviour.
      And if you aren't sure whether I tell the truth just ask me and I'll tell you. (As a pathological liar I sometimes drift away from the truth without noticing it.)

      You need to visit the capital city, Vienna - it's fantastic there! Best city on earth I use to say.

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    10. okay NM, we'r friends, I've never had a socio friend by now, or I didn't know, have you ever met another sociopath, if you did, what is like??
      Also you should visit Italy too,it has very nice weather

      abc


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    11. Jesus F Christ, abc.
      My IQ has gone down a couple points just because I was masochistic enough to read your retarded ramblings.

      You wanted to fuck someone up?
      Go for dramatic, personal and guaranteed to give them nightmares featuring you for life:

      Get a very sharp knife. Go up to them and slash your wrists. Down the arm, not a cross. Plunge the knife nice and deep into your gut. Pull out and give them a big hug. I'll leave the dramatic last words up to you.
      Both your and my problems solved. Everybody happy :)

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    12. @abc:
      Cheers to this new friendship!

      I've met a great deal of people who were similar to me, but when it comes to emotions and empathy, let alone morals and views on the meaning of life most people were entirely different from me.

      There was this one psychiatrist though, his eyes and face used to change when I was alone with him, in a sort of way I felt as if I didn't had to pretend anymore. He was the first person ever who told me how to cope with this wicked world and why everyone else seems so crazy.
      He could look right through me and wasn't upset whenever I tried to fool or manipulate him, resilient personality. He told me some stuff I still hold as principles up to this day. May he rest in peace, he helped me a lot.

      Haven't been to Italy either, I'll think about it, I prefer cold climate and cloudy skies though.

      @Anon 10:01,
      If your IQ dropped it wasn't stable anyway. xD
      Good concept though, except you forgot about the smile. Big wide grin across the face, from one ear to the other throughout the whole procedure.
      Without twitching or showcase of pain. That'll scare them out for a long time.

      Delete
  7. Evil??? or just human nature.

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  8. Embrace ALL of yourself, the "good" and "bad". Instead of fighting yourself or your thoughts that you demonize, you can work alongside with yourself.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Better to understand yourself than hate yourself.

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    2. What do you mean Jelizza?


      abc

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    3. Well I just don't think it's bad to write or read a book about insights into our own human nature... anyone who reads this book IS reading about themself, in one way or another, and you can learn about yourself by reading this book, even if you are not a sociopath. I don't think it is enabling bad behaviour, I don't think it even really has an intention. I think it was a journey of self discovery and it was put together to benefit others, however it can, and to make some money.

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    4. I mean we all can do whatever we want anyways, we don't need an author to tell us so.

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    5. And so when they tell us that we can do whatever we want, they are not giving us permission, they are just letting us know this is something that we can do.

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    6. Right,I think I like you




      abc


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    7. That's right, I think I like you Jeliza


      abc

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    8. is that you in that picture Jeliza??


      abc

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  9. Cursed are ye, ONLY because you think in terms of "good" and "evil," yourself being at all times, "good".

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  10. Interesting morning. On the treadmill, doing my usual 30 minutes of cardio to keep my 70 year old body alive, cheering myself up by watching SIX FEET UNDER a realistic but fictional television series about death and dying. Fifteen minutes in, go very dizzy. Transitory Ischemic Attack? AKA ministroke? I've had at least three. Seems most likely thing to kill me. Wife gone with car for the day. I'm home alone. FAST – acronym for stroke warning signs. Hard to evaluate if alone.

    Face. Drooping? Just looked in mirror. Seem OK.
    Arms. I seem to be able to hold both arms up.
    Speech. I seem to be able to speak coherently, but who can evaluate themselves?
    Should I call 911?
    Should I call my neighbors a quarter mile away in the woods and ask them to to evaluate me on the “FACE” test?

    No. I will post a stupid comment on SW. Only appropriate to be the last comment I make in my life.

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  11. 'm not done yet. I just noticed that TIME MAGAZINE has nominated a doctor who contracted ebola while treating people with ebola in West Africa. This gives me an idea for sociopath redemption.

    Sociopaths are not very fearful. Those of you reading this who want to be accepted for what you are, sign up to help treat Ebola patients. You lack fear. You can be very intelligent and meticulous in planning. Go to Africa. Help treat Ebola patients. After a year of helping stop this terrible disease, unveil yourselves as altruistic psycho/socio paths. (That is, come out of the broom closet.)

    Next year, the Time Magazine “Person of the Year” will be the noble, altruistic psycho/socio path. You will be honored at the United Nations. You will be given a passport for anywhere in the world. You will be given a special document to show cops, identifying you as a GOOD SOCIOPATH. You will pass Go. You will get $200. You will be sent to the planet Mars.

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    Replies
    1. how's your wife??


      abc

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    2. I'm not sure how my wife is. She's away for the day, having her eyes examined. Are you going to volunteer to fight Ebola? I'm not.

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    3. Ebola isn't even a real threat. It's a disappointment.

      Meanwhile, self-obsessed fuckwits are busy posting away on their Facebook accounts like there's someone out there who gives a fuck.

      All complacent and docile. Boring, boring, boring.

      Delete
  12. If you're that easily influenced by reading one book, you have other problems.

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  13. As usual, all comments posted here are coherent, relevant, interesting and useful. Hard to think of a better example than someone who proclaims that "Ebola is not a real threat. It's a disappointment."

    I am trying to imagine what would not be a disappointment to this imaginary person. Would getting Ebola for real be a satisfying and meaningful experience? Would be close enough to a nuclear explosion so you can watch people dying slowly of radiation poisoning be rewarding and interesting. Knowing that soon enough you will begin to glow in the dark and become a nuclear zombie?

    I think I will get back on the treadmill and see if I drop dead. Good bye to everyone. Cheer and applaud if you never hear from me again. Say, "Fuck you," if I post again.

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  14. get real man, fuck you

    abc

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  15. This comment has been removed by the author.

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  16. How can someone who has no name say, "Get real man." As far as fucking me . . . promises, promises.

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    1. Shit I fucked up, I don't know why I said those things to you, I barely know you, I hope you'll forgive me old man, I know your gonna leave us soon from what I've read from your comments, anyway happy funeral



      abc

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    2. Now you're playing mean. When somebody apologizes and says "forgive me," I don't know what to do. Most of the people I know in "real life" (the non Internet world) are always being nice and altruistic and I have to watch my tongue. It's kind of a relief to come here where everybody says "fuck you," and nobody cares about hurting anybody's feelings.

      It kind of throws me for a loop when I see somebody here start acting as if you care. I mean, is there anything sweeter or more sentimental than saying, "Happy funeral."

      I got back on the treadmill and finished the rest of that episode of 6 Feet Under. I made an appointment to see my health team next Wednesday. I guess you are stuck with being nice to me until then. Fuck you. But nicely.

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    3. I'm sorry that I've faked caring sir, I hope I didn't hurt your feelings, if you have any, its just that faking is like second nature to me, I also think your an intelligent being, from your writings, for how long you are married sir??

      Also you can fuck but gently please


      abc

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    4. there's no wife. no girlfriend either

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    5. I have been married for 49 years. To celebrate 50 years i plan to have my granddaughter (with two mommies and two daddies) divorce us and then marry us again. I don't think anybody else in the family is on board with the plan, but that's usually true with my schemes. Of course, given my likelihood of having a stroke before then, I will let her throw my body into the woods behind our house.and recite the old ballad Twa Corbies.

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    6. Twa Corbies [Two Crows]

      As I was walking all alone,
      I heard two crows (or ravens) making a moan;
      One said to the other,
      "Where shall we go and dine today?"
      "In behind that old turf wall,
      I sense there lies a newly slain knight;
      And nobody knows that he lies there,
      But his hawk, his hound and his lady fair."
      "His hound is to the hunting gone,
      His hawk to fetch the wild-fowl home,
      His lady's has taken another mate,
      So we may make our dinner sweet."
      "You will sit on his white neck-bone,
      And I'll peck out his pretty blue eyes;
      With one lock of his golden hair
      We'll thatch our nest when it grows bare."
      "Many a one for him is moaning,
      But nobody will know where he is gone;
      Over his white bones, when they are bare,
      The wind will blow for evermore."

      Everyone here is invited to the funeral when they toss my bones into the woods.

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  17. I agree with others who posted that M.E.'s book can be taken by various readers in different ways, i.e., a guide as to how to minimize impulses in order to live a more stable life, or as a validation of the scheming ways. Whatever the case may be, the discussion of sociopathy is essential, for both the perps and their victims. The exploration and deconstruction of the state of being that socios experience is of value to all who care to understand it.

    As as aside, one thing I've seen on this blog regarding empaths and their so-called inability to deliberately choose to hurt others seems to me over-rated. I know many empaths who, if you mess with them, are more than happy to rip others apart. Nor do they always feel as much guilt as some on this blog have claimed. If you discover a viper in your bed you kill it without a second thought. Least I do. Unless the snake happens to be one I'm particularly fond of and figure I can 'manage' its impulses. (A dangerous assumption, of course, as the Frog and Scorpion story aptly illustrates.) In any case, I would never assume that the snake 'feels' the way I do.

    Perhaps ego identity has some play here. If the ego of an empath is centered on their moral righteousness, they can and do justify killing just about anything. If the ego is identified with being great-and-all-powerful, again, you can justify doing anything. But if the ego is merged with a higher principle, a meaning or cause that 'lives' beyond the finite personality, then killing becomes much more complicated, fraught with angst.

    Grendel

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    1. Hey Grendel what's up man, your still mad??


      abc

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    2. That's an interesting perspective, Grendel. Thanks for sharing.

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    3. @DocSciFi, Thanks.

      @Anon, Mad as a gorilla wearing party hat. Far as I can tell, everyone is a bit wacko. It's the style of crazy that either fascinates or not. Nothing personal. Here on socioworld, you could be either or of a different breed of batty altogether. You judge. I'm just here to play.

      Grendel

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    4. Hi Grendel,

      I recall reading some time ago that scientist have identified the right parietal lobe as having something to do with "connectedness" - some say spirituality (or maybe "spiritual experiences"?).

      What was interesting if I recall correctly, is that it was the case that when there was decreased functioning of the area, one was more prone to be less "self focused." (I recall the jokes about religion being a result of "brain damage" circulating as a result.).

      And, though I couldn't find the articles, I also seem to recall low serotonin levels being correlated with religuiosity.

      Maybe that's the one part of our brain that works right? ;p

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    5. Hi Harry,

      Never heard that one before.

      The parietal lobes are about sensory info, spatial sense and language.

      I've found inspiration in cognitive neuroscience researcher, Dr. Michael Persinger's 'God Helmut' studies in creativity and spirituality. His team induced spiritual vision via weak magnetic fields stimulating the temporal lobes. His work shows a correlation between certain wave patterns with spiritual experiences. As I recall and found most fascinating was that the subject's visions were colored by their religious beliefs. In other words, if you believed in heaven and hell, you saw angels and demons. If you were Hindu, you saw Kali or Shiva. That's REALLY interesting. Because it sheds light on The Placebo Effect, which is profoundly puzzling, hopeful in terms of mind over matter. Believing is Seeing. We see what we believe.

      Grendel

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    6. Hi Grendel,

      Trans-cranial Magnetic Stimulation seems to be getting all sorts of press these days. As an "experience junkie," I am half tempted to build a device for giggles. Here's one article I found on a quick search - the good old Huffing-Glue Post.

      http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/04/20/god-spot-in-brain-is-not-_n_1440518.html

      I've meditated since I was a teenager - probably one of the things that got me through some of my more unhinged days. I've often wondered what my brain scan looks like when I'm engaged in various practices...

      "Affordable" fMRI scans would be kinda fun...

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    7. Should read, What we believe we see.

      Grendel

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    8. HL, " I am half tempted to build a device for giggles"

      Do it. And do tell. If you don't post here post-Trans-Brain-Mag-Stim, we'll know you went straight to hell. ;-)

      "I've often wondered what my brain scan looks like"

      I've had them done in a veteran's hospital, as part of study about cigarette addiction. I loved seeing my brain in action, all those vibrant moving colors. The results, according the person reading the MRI screen as I lay inside the thrumming metal cocoon, were very unusual. The patterns of my brain were not normal for someone undergoing this procedure. She asked me whether I'd fallen asleep and was dreaming. I said no. I was watching my inner movies, trying to distract myself from the goddamn piston noise.

      Grendel.

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    9. "Should read, What we believe we see."

      Grendel, it is also the other way:)

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    10. You're right, Doc. Thank you for pointing that out.

      I'm dyslectic. Can't always read my own writing let alone the bytes of others. Also, I'm not all here. :-))))

      Grendel

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  18. the book is bad
    there's not one good psychopath story in here
    she's obviously to scared to be found out

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    1. Give this man a cookie

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    2. Give him a big soggy rat like snake meal

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    3. @Anon, "there's not one good psychopath story in here"

      Depends on your definition of a 'good story.' I found it fascinating and extremely lucid, well-written. Course, I'm a sucker for stories and good writing in general. I admit there's not much in terms of graphic examples, but personally I don't need that to get a thrill.

      Why don't you find it good? Not gory enough?

      Grendel

      Delete
  19. socio's only try to do good to convince others or themselves they have worth. I've seen some insecurities come into play with sociopaths. It's the basis I belive of what's going on when you have those evil thoughts. No matter how much good you do.. it always come back to that. Great that you are all self aware and possibly can learn to reign it in, but I think it's always going to surface & come out. Thus, the non-trust. What good you do has no genuine basis. Intentions are everything. If you are not feeling it from the heart but only do it to promote yourself in some way.. If you have no real empathy. Don't bother. it wont change my mind.

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    1. Hi Anon,

      I'm not trying to change your mind, but rather understand it. What I am interested to understand is why rational self interest isn't enough?

      Delete
    2. Anon,
      "socio's only try to do good to convince others or themselves they have worth."
      I don't feel the need to convince anyone of anything, I do what I do regardless whether it be called good or bad - the only restrictions are the societal workings which would make it impossible for me to keep control if I decide to go amok. They'd lock me up for sure, and I can't stand getting told what to do and think whole day long, I'd go mad if that happens again.

      "I've seen some insecurities come into play with sociopaths."
      I always get horribly fidgety and feel insecure if I don't know what's going on and feel it might be very important, or if I'm out of whatever reason am not able to foresee what the consequences of my behavior will be.

      "(...) but I think it's always going to surface & come out."
      I am what I am but people almost always choose to see what they want to see instead of the 'heartless' person I am or 'the bitter truth', even if I don't tell them lies or excuses for my behavior. You ain't gonna make me responsible for that, eh?
      The non-trust is a logical consequence to that empathic delusions.

      "Intentions are everything."
      People quarrel over that for thousands of years. Some say it's the other way 'round, that only the result matters. Murder is murder, even if you kill them to cleanse the world, they say. Your conscience should underline that, if stuff I've read about it is true: Empaths seem to feel bad upon killing someone even if they had to do it, like to save their lives or dear ones.

      "Don't bother. it wont change my mind."
      I don't intend to change your mind, opinions re no facts - mine neither. Just felt the urge to comment :)

      Delete
  20. Perhaps too much emphasis is put on the emotional dispositions of a person (or lack of emotions, rather than the set of beliefs a person has about the world around them and themselves. It's as if the cortex is seen as the output of the limbic system and brain stem rather than an entity in its own right. I think this goes back to Freud and his animalistic drives.

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    1. Hi Doc,

      That is part of the point I was trying to make the other day. I can't help but wonder if the whole conversation about empathy and remorse is a bit of a red herring.

      Seems to me that what is really the more important is the aggression and the lack of impulse control. Everything else is after the (f)act. At that point, it seems to me that a different process kicks in - the one that spins all the justifications and rationalizations and such - "The Bullshit Machine."

      What really does the damage is the aggression. The Bullshit Machine just makes it incomprehensible to empathic types.

      It's an idea - still haven't had my coffee...

      Delete
    2. well, I am not sure what you are referring to. Aggression and impulse originate I guess in the brain stem -- flight or fight. I was thinking of beliefs like "you are either a predator or a prey".... I think there are many beliefs that make up a person and premise their behavior too.

      Delete
  21. Hey Doc, " It's as if the cortex is seen as the output of the limbic system and brain stem rather than an entity in its own right. I think this goes back to Freud and his animalistic drives."

    Within the context of a "set of beliefs" would you please elaborate on the above quote? I totally agree,btw, that too much emphasis is put on emotional dispositions, cold, hot or in-between. There's something more going on. A mystery.

    Grendel

    ReplyDelete

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