Saturday, June 27, 2009

Prototypes and archetypes (part 2)

My response:
I'm sorry you've been having such a rough time. It's hard for me to know if he is a sociopath. It's always very hard and inaccurate to diagnose someone else third-person. There could be lots of ways to diagnose him. The most telling things in any diagnosis, though, are the things that a person says in reference to himself. For instance, his asking you whether you think it is possible that someone would not have a conscience, his saying that he does what he wants, or his saying he will fuck you over -- those are clear indicators of sociopathy because they show both his self-awareness and his acknowledgment of his irregularities. If he's not a sociopath, he is a completely self-absorbed asshole and you shouldn't be sorry at all if you hurt his feelings. If he is a sociopath...

Loving his mom and dog are not necessarily inconsistent with him being a sociopath. I love my mother more than anyone else in the world. I am also very sweet to her, always buying her things, giving her money, taking care of her, but I do not say things like "I love you," either. She's my mother. He's a source of unconditional love and acceptance for me, and is in many ways an extension of me, so it makes sense for me to maintain that relationship. Same with the dog for him, probably.

When I tell people I love them I really mean it in that moment. I told someone today that I loved them. What does it mean? It's a very childish, fickle infatuation. I also sometimes hate this person -- quite often, in fact. I feel like this person secretly judges me, and pretends to be all understanding without truly accepting me. I behave towards this person similarly to the way your boyfriend behaves toward you. On the one hand there are the moments of awe and affection that I feel for the person. On the other, there are the feelings of rejection, boredom, disinterest, selfishness, etc. that motivate other behaviors.

This guy seems particularly bad because he is so conflicted about himself. Although he may be unusually insightful and self-aware, he doesn't understand himself. He is probably both in awe of himself and fearful of himself. He seeks to control others because he does not feel like he has control over himself. He warns you that he will fuck you over not because he wants to, but because he fears/worries/knows that he will. His asserting that gives him the illusion of control over the situation when really he feels like he only has predictive power, not power to change outcomes. He says he does what he wants, but he's really just trying to own the fact that he does what his impulses direct him to do -- then play it off like it is all part of some master plan of his. His bravado in saying he "does what he wants" is his way of trying to pretend that he is making conscious, reasoned decisions in accord with his values and preferences instead of being a slave to impulses he neither understands nor can control.

I'm not surprised he is in his early 20s. Sociopaths are the absolute worst in their late teens and early 20s. They're the equivalent of teenagers with raging hormones. Late teens and early 20s start the sociopath's first real tastes of freedom and power, which they begin abusing like a kid on meth. Once it gets to a certain point of excess, and the first real, lasting damages to their lives occur, they will then withdraw for a period of introspection, which will last until they gain a certain level of understanding and self-acceptance. At least this has been my own experience and the experience of many sociopaths I have known. If he doesn't go through any of these phases, then he will stay as he is forever. But how could he? Really, it doesn't sound like his charmed life will stay that way for much longer.

He's not a bad person necessarily, but he certainly has the potential to be and has definitely been acting like one. Don't feel bad for allowing him to feel the consequences of his actions. He will not change for the better until he feels like he needs to. He will not feel like he needs to unless/until his current modus operandi ceases to function.

I don't know what's up with his impotence. It could be that power/control is what gets him off, or that he has come to associate sex with things that you would consider abnormal. If he wasn't gaming you, or not as much as the other girls, it could be that his difficulty stemmed from the lack of power and control he felt in the relationship. But that's just a guess.

You cannot change him. He will not even change himself if he thinks for even a second it will work out with you without him changing. It may be that you have already communicated this sufficiently to him, i.e. that things will not work out ever between you, at least not as they currently are. His avoidance of you could be him sulking or trying to get back at you for this, or it could be his tacit acknowledgment (albeit not fully conscious) that you mean what you say and that he can no longer game you. I'm sure you would prefer it to be the latter, so feel free to think that way -- it's at least plausible. In any case, do not be afraid of hurting his feelings. Even if you did hurt them, he deserved it a million times over.

Hope this helps.


  1. I must applaud you, M.E.

    This was surprisingly insightful.
    I really didn't expect this.

  2. Guys not a sociopath, you're just making it easy for him to be an asshole by being so needy.
    Or you have some other charm that he may need later, so he keeps stringing you along, think money.
    Sex is usually something sociopaths are good at, put it in, stick it up, not a problem, just slightly disorganized masturbation, sexual problems generally mean some other psychological fuck up.
    Look at yourself and think, "what seems comfortable?" in this sort of constant abuse. Chances are the problem lie with you, and even if you break up with this loser, you'll pick another.

  3. Lawl, impotence. He probably likes gaming chicks and blowing doods. Livin life on the down-low. M.E. is so right about the late teenage and early twenties. I liked your response M.E. but I still think what that chick wrote was protracted shit.

  4. I suggest that he doesn't return her calls, not because he's trying to get back, or that he's sulking...but because it works for him.

    He likes that she is under his complete control. He knows that if he doesn't call, that she will call him a dozen times, and he can ignore the calls, knowing it drives her nuts.

    Now. If she were to completely ignore him, drop him him like a hot would pique his interest again & the game is back on.

    The classic, endless dance of these types of relationships. Until either the sociopath loses interest (through a continued deterioration of the relationship, or he finds something better to distract him, etc.), or the empath firmly, and permanently walks away.

    It's really the only way to safely "get even" with a sociopath. Walk away when the game is on. It'll drive 'em nuts for a teensy-weensy moment.

    Then they're off to the next game.

  5. I think you were spot on there BizyLizy... but im guessing it depends on the motive of the game? ... im probably wrong though...

  6. Yes, it can drive them nuts, to the point they come to your door to find out what the problem is, things usually deteriorate from there.
    You're dealing with unstable people with poor impulse control and anger management issues.
    Why not go and jump in the tiger pen of your local zoo, dressed in lamb chops?
    I'm guessing, as a child, you put your fingers in light sockets for the buzz?

  7. Are you referring to me ANON!

  8. Various Tinkerbell, there seems to be a common urge to lick electrical sockets on this site.

    A sort of Russian roulette of the soul.

  9. Actually i think you may have a point there!

  10. Tinkerbell, There are a lot of people who wish they had no feelings, to avoid their hurt, and there are people who would rather be hurt than feel their own.

    Sociopaths are just not a wise choice, as they have no natural stopping limit, they almost always destroy themselves and anyone else whose in the vicinity, either emotionally or otherwise.

    Licking crumbs out of toasters is safer.

  11. Hey simplesimon...your funny!!

  12. I am, there's no end to my amusing ways, or my amusing end.

  13. Anon...

    It has been argued that to actively seek revenge on a sociopath during a breakup is dangerous.

    Now it is dangerous to simply walk away?

    I'm confused. Which is the self-destructive-licking-electrical-sockets behavior?

    Just curious.

  14. It largely depends on the person involved, you would know best being most intimate, but you're also likely to be the least objective. It's a catch 22, seek advice from friends and professionals.

  15. Basically bizylizy the "electric socket"...was a sarcastic way of calling some posters on here was a well worded insult...thats all. you know much like that saying "playing with fire".

  16. If a sociopath kept sticking fingers in and/or licking the "electric socket", that would make them stupid. When empathy is involved it is a little more complex, being that an electric socket is an inanimate object. You cannot really become attatched to it emotionally. One could just be a combination of naive and self-loathing. Or a masochist.

  17. Thats true Scarlett...well said

  18. "Once it gets to a certain point of excess, and the first real, lasting damages to their lives occur, they will then withdraw for a period of introspection, which will last until they gain a certain level of understanding and self-acceptance."

    I did not realise this to be common- guess I learned something today.

    Thanks M.E


  19. i learned alot from this this was very helpful to me in learning about myself


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