Tuesday, January 27, 2015

Culpability

From a reader:

http://www.npr.org/templates/transcript/transcript.php?storyId=180096559

RAINE: You know, I mean at one level we can talk about treatment. We may come on to that a little bit later. But take that individual with all the boxes checked, all the risk factors, and their free will was constrained early in life, OK, and they commit a murder. Then let's take you, who I presume you don't have too many risk factors in your life, and then you go and kill me, you commit the same act.

You've got no excuses; the other person has. Don't we go easier on that other person and instead of either executing them or taking away their basic rights, we put them more in a safe, secure institution, which - where the regime is not as harsh, and their basic human rights are not lost?

So at one level, even before we get into treatment, I think people like this could be held in safer, more humane conditions because, you know, prisons are dangerous places to be. And, you know, we should cut them some slack. Protect society - I'm not saying let them back out on the street, because, as I say, they could be walking time bombs waiting to explode - but let's step back a bit and recognize that, you know, OK, maybe we do have free will, but some people have more free will than others.

78 comments:

  1. Should antisocial sociopathy be considered as "mental disease" in courts? The simplest specimens may not be able to resist criminal urges, even if they know right from wrong? Many seem to be in a state of "conscious psychosis", driven by violent/sexual fantasies. Are these really sane..?

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  2. 5th house: Here we come to the TRUE motivation for the killing of Caylee.
    The 5th house is "The house of pleasure." It pertains to sex, gambling, creativity
    and children. Casey has Mars, Neptune, and Uranus in the 5th house.
    Mars, is a "male" planet. You know, "Men Are From Mars, Women From Venus." For Casey to have Mars in the house of "casual sex" means her sexual
    urge is very "insistant and male-like." Very reminisisent of a Sociopath. She also has Uranus, the planet of unusual and "explosive" surprises in this house.
    Many "unwed" mothers have this. And lastly, she has Neptune-the planet of self
    delusion-in the house of children. She denied the preganacy up to the 7th mounth. Her mother Cindy-with whom she had a "co-dependant relationship-also
    denied the pregnancy. Myself, I have Saturn in the 5th house. Saturn, as I said,
    before, is "The Great Maliefic." The house that you have Saturn in is where you
    feel "compressed" and have much to overcome. I have never had sex. I certainly have no children. I generally annony the "fairer sex." At the age of 56,
    I have every reason to expect I will die in this condition. Quite different from
    Casey, to say the least!
    6th house: Service (Employment) and Health. Casey will not work. Like many
    low functioning Sociopaths she has no desire to work, and won't have to. Casey
    has no planets in this house, because it is not a pressing concern for her. Neither do I.

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  3. And u would know that these ppl have those dissorders how? Did u or sifu earn a phd in psy. Also a skeptic might suggest that sifu is not a dexter type but rather a typical psyco that is less concerned with what's good for society and entirely concerned with his own self gratification. Ie u in office ;). Also what criminal urges do u have. Power, money, and status play out on a global scale not a local one. Has anyone heard of social coersion and the power of group think.

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  4. No amount of regulation will make prisons safe because any place you have a bunch of psychopaths thrown together in close daily contact is never going to be Disneyland.

    Carrie

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  5. Here you have Disneyland:
    http://www.theguardian.com/society/2012/may/18/halden-most-humane-prison-in-world

    I myself have been incarcerated four times. I am a productive member of society.

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  6. 7th house: Partnerships. Legal matters. Marriage. Casey has Jupiter in the 7th
    house. Jupiter is the "lucky" planet. Casey prevailed in her court case against
    incedible odds. (Legal matters.) If Casey does get married, she will likely benefit
    as well. This perspective husband will at least, provide enough to keep her off the streets. So she will "benefit" from that. I have Mars in the 7th house. I DO
    NOT benefit from partnerships, the law, or marriage. People oppose me in those
    areas.
    8th house: Death, Transformation, and Sex. Casey has her Sun-the most
    important planet and "theme" of her life, in this house. We would never have
    known about Casey had she not murdered her child and gotten away with it.
    "Death," put Casey on the map. Casey will have to "transform" to have any hope
    of a "normal" life. I have Venus in in this house. My "lovers" will be non-existant
    unattainable, or have to be dug up from the graveyard.
    9th house: Higher education, Religion, Foreign Travel. Casey has Venus-the
    planet of love-in this house. She can only contact "friends" through the computer
    because she can't be out and about. Whatever love interests she has will be
    "long distance," and it was reccomended that she go to a foreign country where
    she is not known. Her prior boyfriends came through internet hook-ups. She
    "might" find love with educated, philosophical, or religiously forgiving types.
    I have the Sun in the 9th house my philosophy and religion is EVERYTHING to
    me. It's pratically the only thing I speak about. M.E. is the same. Please M.E....
    To be continued.

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  7. Do u know me? If u do r u a socio?

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  8. RA, this one is for you. Here is a man who started a passion at 87, and finds it difficult to continue today at 100 because his passion is writing about his friends. It's in your best interest to think of something fun to do for the next 30 years and let death be the unexpected surprise for you if it comes before then.


    "Edward Gerson, a retired button manufacturer and plastics innovator, started his writing career late. He was 87 years old, to be precise, when he took on the role of chronicling the goings-on of Dartmouth College’s class of 1935.

    When he started writing the alumni updates in 2001, there were more than 150 classmates and lots of material. As he noted in his inaugural column, “the Lord will provide the obits, but the news of your lives has to come from you.”

    He found plenty besides death to narrate: Hobbies, cruises, moves to warmer climes and assisted-living facilities. No tidbit was too humdrum. In July 2006, readers learned that one classmate “is going strong, but his cat is driving him crazy, walking around his head until he lets her out at 5:30 a.m.”

    Today, Mr. Gerson is 100 years old, and only three of his classmates survive, according to Dartmouth. That is creating some challenges.

    Mr. Gerson relays what news he can of the two alums he is in contact with: Edwin Reich, a former clothier he met at summer camp in 1926, and Irving Sager, who was in real estate. For a time he chronicled Mr. Reich ’s lifetime holes-in-one until he stopped playing golf, and Mr. Sager’s love life, until his last flame—who was actually Mr. Gerson’s first cousin—died in 2013 at 96."

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    1. Charming, kind, and down right empathic of you to think of me. You know what the scorpion said to the frog.

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    2. :) Don't scare me...

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    3. Daughters of AnarchyJanuary 28, 2015 at 5:59 PM

      He might also like a website called ," growing bolder", I belong to their facebook group and you have people in their ninties, 100's running marathons and doing things only we younger ones (im not that young 37) never had the chance to do. its so encouraging because age is just a number and many of them are runners, teachers, singers, poets, painters.....etc, etc, just living LIFE to its fullest.

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    4. That's so cool. Your age is the spring chicken age for older folks, make the best out of next five years, those are tough years. Once 42, you realize that indeed the answer to every question is 42. I loved 42, I wish I did not fail to love the 5 years between 37 and 42.

      Thank you for the reference to the growing bold site. I'll check it out.

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    5. Daughters of AnarchyJanuary 29, 2015 at 11:19 AM

      YW. Just try to enjoy all seasons of life. At least we try are best too. My step dad always told me, life begins after 50 ! ;).

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  9. Public radio had an interesting discussion where people younger than 40 were totally cool with something while people over 40 were finding it hideous. And, their conclusion was to shun the older people.

    And, what's this thing? It's young ones' style of talking where there are large doses of insertions of 'like' 'you know' 'I mean.' People older than 40 could not give credibility to the ideas of someone who speaks like that.

    When today's post started with 'You know, I mean' and ended with three 'you know's I knew I was over 40. Had no desire to pay attention to this person. This is a new growth direction for me, I need to get over this as there'll be more of these around me if I were to live to 100.

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    1. "I know. right!" That's my button phrase - that's when I know I'm dealing with someone that is "too young" for me.

      I read the whole transcript and he does use the phrase, "you know" a LOT. In addition, this guy is all over the place - and admits it. That's the one thing to recommend the interview: to see his internal narrative and conflict on the topic of biology and culpability. He is quite conflicted and candid about it.

      It starts to get at the contrast between retributive justice versus restorative justice - in spite of the guy being a crummy speaker.

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    2. I checked out who he is. The guy is much older than we are. You know how narcissists get stuck at a young age, I honestly think there is a touch of that going on here. Even his faculty photograph is young (as in an old wrinkled face holding a skull right next to his head). These types are fun for students, till you go against their interests.

      His site says he's not accepting any graduate students in Spring 2015. Just posting that on his site is telling you something.

      I think this guy got lucky because he got his tenure years ago and was inan institution where very qualified PhD students are accepted. He looks more like a showman than a scientist. A showman reporting his students' findings?

      Oh, well. For all that I know he could be a great guy. All that cynicism here is really for shits and giggles, just covering possibilities. BUT, I could not last long listening to him if he's indeed sounding like one of his undergraduates. I'd say 'no, I don't know,' 'yes, what do you mean?' and get him to deal with his language just a bit.

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    3. Speaking of a narc teacher in the class. For your enjoyment:
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dukggt0Bm_4

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    4. LOL! If more of my teachers were like that I might have paid ore attention in school. 8)~

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  10. I'm so confused. If we're both socios according to u. Then we should be speaking the same language here ;)

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  11. His language being that of a younger person is easily explained BY his being a teacher. He is around younger people more often than not and has adapted his speech patterns to mimic theirs. He did mention that his brain profile and heart rate indicators matched the sociopath profile. Which would explain the verbal mimicking and his preference for the company of sociopaths in his studies.

    The meat of the subject though is interesting. To what extent should people be held accountable for their behavior? Perhaps this is the wrong question though. If we as a global society want to eliminate anti-social behavior at what point should people be perhaps tested for risk factors? Most violent criminal behavior can be traced back to a horrendous upbringing, add to that a biological predisposition for "criminal" behavior and you have a recipe for disaster.

    The only way I can see this changing is if we protect children from a being raised in environment that predisposes them to violence. That solution, however, would take a social movement and many parents would lose parental rights. Then you would have tons of kids being raised by the government and considering THEIR track record I don't see that as working out any better.

    Let us then predict what would happen if the criminal justice system decided to move to this paradigm where we had a sliding scale of punishment for people who could provide a sad sad backstory. We do to an extent have this in place but in practice the deciding factor in punishments is more often the social/monetary influence of the criminal. (The Texas affluenenza case for example or the fact that people on a lower socioeconomic scale are punished/convicted at a disproportionate rate/scale for drug offenses). But for the purposes of this thought exercise we discount wealth/social status as a factor in punishment.

    Here is the problem. Once you stop holding people responsible for their behavior regardless of the circumstances, which was the case in Affulenza trial, you open the door for EVERYONE to walk away from their crimes scott free. Well if they can afford a smart enough lawyer that is. Come to think of it that IS the system we have in place. Personally I believe that if it is proved you knew the difference between right and wrong and it can be proved that you did the crime there should be no sliding scale of justice at all. There should be a set punishment for each crime, not 2-10 years and shit like we have now.

    I mean there are some crimes where the punishment can range from probation to 20 years in the penitentiary. WTF? Our justice system could use a huge overhaul but that is rant for another day.

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    1. The proper punishment is to make him work as a slave for the poorest people in Texas. Each morning he cleans their toilets by licking them, then grows food for them in polluted plantations, and then sleeps in the pig pens.

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    2. Hi PB,

      I mostly agree with you - the twist I think might be worth considering is scaling fines according to net worth and/or income. I believe Germany does this - if you and your boss are both caught speeding, his fine will be higher (presuming his salary, etc. are higher). I think this makes some sense.

      Trying to apply this sort of adjustment for violent crimes based on biology however, makes little sense to me.

      The whole "affluenza" case makes me shake my head and wonder, "how much longer until the torches and pitchforks?"

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    3. The simple thing is to just punish psychopaths (and other offenders) for their crimes for purely utilitarian reasons (the way you punish a dog to train it to behave more desirably in the future) without bothering to hate and blame them.

      If you want to contemplate this more, you could read this and follow up on it. Sam Harris's book "Free Will" offers a nice exploration of the issue.

      Most people find the idea of cold, dispassionate punishment of criminals a bit troubling or too hard to wrap their heads around, because they are only able to hit someone when angry. Being a psychopath, I personally don't have this problem - if someone needs hitting (or stroking) I'm able to hit (or stroke) as required.

      But most people like living with the belief that their feelings tell them "the truth" and they simply like hating "evil" people so much that they don't want to give that up because that's where logic leads.

      Of course, if you take the utilitarian approach, it can lead to results that seem unfair. Eg profiling groups that behave badly, identifying potential criminals and dealing with them in advance to reduce costs. Eg. treating them with meds, incarcerating them or killing them before they deal with everybody else.

      The moral intuitions about whether or not that's OK shifts when we have treatment choices and whether we are talking about humans or animals.

      Eg imagine there are people who are disproportionately likely to physically attack their spouses when enraged. Imagine we can find them by scanning their brains. If we can't treat them, someone might propose to ban them from certain cities. Many people would think that was immoral. And yet, certain cities do that, for certain breeds of dogs, which people think are more dangerous than other breeds of dogs.

      The moment there's a low-cost and effective treatment, peoples' moral intuitions shift and they feel OK about identifying and forcibly treating people (or animals).

      If it was possible to identify psychopathic criminals before they committed crimes and fix them - analogous to how we fix thyroid problems - a bunch of people would be all for it.

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  12. Yeahhhhh that's what I ment. Texas prison shit and the whole and all that.

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    1. It's hard to know where to draw the line. My father, very bright, beat my mother. My aunt (mother's sis) kidnapped me at age 4 and kept me with her for about six months. Hard to know what actually happened (as I was only 4), but my theory is Aunt Rose said, "Go ahead and fuck over my sister because she is already so ruined, but let me have Stephen or I will call the cops on you." Thereby saving what little sanity I have. Though I wonder, 1948, did anyone take accusations of wife abuse seriously back then. Also Aunt Rose was barren and always wanted to have a child, so her motives were not exactly pure, were they?

      Do any of you have pure motives?

      I thought not.

      I might go talk to some high school students tomorrow (if the pieces fall into place, never certain. What should I tell them? To begin with, why would some 15 year old (or so) adolescents want to hear what a senile 71 year old has to say? Did any of you ever learn anything from what elders told you?

      Thought not. Otherwise, you wouldn't be here, would you?

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  13. Rite on. How's that for speech mimicking. Any one on here know me from my former place of emplymnt

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  14. So what is it that u guys want?

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  15. Hi All,

    I liked this:

    "In the last and most philosophical chapter Dr. Baron-Cohen discusses situations in which an individual who is not otherwise lacking in empathy may behave cruelly. Citing the philosopher Hannah Arendt’s term “the banality of evil,” and discussing the work of Stanley Milgram and Philip Zimbardo in which ordinary people exhibited cruel behavior, he acknowledges that in most of us empathy may be suspended temporarily, under certain circumstances."

    Having walked this earth for what feels like eons, as an astrologer and counselor of battered women, the marginalized and scorned ,I know quite well the fluctuating tides of empathy, a trait I revere in myself and others, believing that the capacity to walk inside the moccasins of other life forms, plant, animal and human, is essential to great art and great acts of innovation of life itself.

    But, when I'm suffering 'compassion fatigue' I am not feeling tolerant or forgiving. I want to strike back, as in saying something cruel, or treat you so coldly that you will sting with the memory of how magical and transcendent was my love. Or, I will simply let you rot in your own self-induced misery, content with the knowledge that your karma is coming.

    As for sentencing and free will, I agree with Puppy Basket, whose keen dissection hits the mark: the crime defines the time. And that we all possess free will. To a lessor or greater degree, it's true. But that's true for all species and all individuals. As humans we have much more capacity to ruminate and reflect, to understand consequences, than do plants and animals, who are largely regulated by pure instinct. It takes very special circumstances for a wild creature to modulate/suppress it survival, predatory reactions.

    As for restorative versus punitive justice, someone once said that a civilization can be measured by the way it treats the disenfranchised, the weak and marginalized, those who are different and misunderstood. In 21st century society, restoring individuals to productive life makes sense, unless, of course, you prefer living in the novel, 1984

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    1. What a bunch of bullshit. We are living in something close to 1984. It's not an accident that we are the top of the food chain and probably going to destroy most life on earth, including ourselves, in THE SIXTH EXTINCTION. The few creatures that survive will cheer our disappearance and then begin consuming each other.

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    2. Happy Belated Birthday, RA. You're obviously too full of spit and spunk to be on the verge of extinction. Glad to read you're still all here. ;)

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    3. Faust,

      What do you mean by free will?

      You claim we all have some of it.

      In my own experience I don't see me pulling the levers, freely choosing things.

      I certainly don't think about what I'll think before I think it.

      If I end this post now or after another sentence - I don't see how I choose it. I just wind up doing one thing and then after the fact I might say, "I did that."

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    4. Anon, you're brilliant.

      No one could possibly 'think' of this sentence of yours:

      "I certainly don't think about what I'll think before I think it."

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    5. Hi Anon and Sceli,

      Sorry. I don't agree. It's a free universe of thought, right? Free-thinking? Does that mean I'm free to do whatever my crooked imagination thinks up? No. That's why I write fiction.

      "I certainly don't think about what I'll think before I think it."

      Sure. So what? What you think in the moment is not free will, I'll grant that. But what you DO with the thoughts afterwards IS free will. Violence perpetrated outside a crime of passion, jealously in particular, occurs rarely. I've envisioned committing acts of violence, but have never gone beyond kicking in the fender of a cab car, and yelling at people who have crossed a serious frigging ethical line. I hate violence, but I have pondered it, and enjoy vicariously, through art, because it expresses the passion of every human soul I know and have ever met. Even thinking those kind of rank thoughts leads to nothing but ugly results.

      That's been my experience.

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    6. Anon,

      Jung once said, Free will is the ability to do gladly that which I must do.

      This does not mean being happy to murder and destroy. It means embracing the unique 'solar path' of the individual, given his traits, using those traits to the benefit of his 'true self.' And, obviously, to the benefit of others, i.e., Jung's path to individualism involved the epic of the hero, who brings back from his quest something that prospers not only himself, but the whole of his people.

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    7. Hi, Faust.
      I took a shot at sarcasm, but appaarently I'm not only not good at getting sarcasm but also communicating it.
      The sentence was as brilliant as mooning.
      To be very clear for the nonnative English speakers, lol:
      2 [ trans. ] informal expose one's buttocks to (someone) in order to insult or amuse them : Dan had whipped around, bent over, and

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    8. Hi Sceli,

      About a lifetime ago (ok, maybe only 25 or so years ago...) a bunch of buddies and I were on our way home from a night of heavy drinking. The road we were on both split and merged from two lanes into one and another car was trying to decide what to do. After what seemed like several minutes of deliberation, we managed to go around them - as we did, several of us mooned the car.

      As we started driving into our subdivision, the car followed us - we were in tears as we thought this was both funny and strange. As we pulled into our driveway, my neighbor pulled into his.

      He stopped waving to me after that...

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    9. Faust,

      There is evidence that peoples' conscious decisions are preceded by unconscious processes that initiate things, and that people nevertheless claim they - the conscious agent - initiates things. Free will is an illusion.

      it doesn't seem to he a very good one either.

      Subjectively, how would it work to freely do things?
      Just try moving a hand or a leg - how is it that you, the thing reading this now, makes that start and stop? you aren't an objet, but somehow you get the meat moving and stopping. but if you don't get it to move well, how can you be responsible - in an ultimate way - as it isn't you in the first place.

      if you pay careful, undivided attention to this stuff, the illusion of being an agent, in control, thinking thoughts (on purpose) and doing things, falls apart again and again.

      you can't stop thinking. you don't control what you think or feel. you don't control your body any more than you control your mind.

      so where is this "free wil"?

      LOL

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    10. Anon, I'm not sure I get the drift of your argument. Because I think that if you develop an observer consciousness, you can 'see' the train of thoughts occurring and that you can decide to act one way or another. I know when my 'dark side' is speaking, I know when a thought is ego-based, mean or petty. And I do decide whether or not to act -- unless, of course, I'm pissed off. If I'm mad enough, then, yeah, a different, more instinctual side takes over.

      As for controlling the body: Yogis do it all the time, by slowing their breathing and heart rate to a near dead stop. Those so-called automatic functions can be consciously regulated.

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    11. If you could control your mind you could stop thinking for a minute. but yoy can't.
      if you could control your body you could stay still at will - eg for an hour. you cannot.

      in both cases your mind will attribute what happens to "you" (the thing that understands these words right now). but "you" don' control that stuff.

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    12. ^^ I think it's time to stop bogarting that blunt. ^^

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  16. The past. The past. The past. Why do all you Sociopath cry babies make
    excuses for your cutthroat behavior based on the past?
    We live ONLY in the NOW. We can live only in the NOW. If a person had sex up
    the wazoo, it wouldn't make any difference about his sexual needs NOW. T
    The cry babies who feel they've been cheated and mistreated. WATER UNDER
    THE BRIDGE! Your eternal essence can't be "cheated." ATTITUDE IS
    EVERYTHING-unless you have no shelter from the blazzard.
    Now, back to Casey.
    10th house: Reptuation and honor. Casey has the astroid Chiorn in the 10th
    house. The location of Chirorn is where you are "wounded" and suffer most.
    Casey's reputation is wounded beyond repair. For the rest of her life, she will be
    the "babykiller" who got away with murder. Myself: I have nothing in the 10th
    house. I never had to worry about my "reputation
    11th house: "Friends" and aspirations. Casey has the Moon in her 11th house.
    The Moon goes through many phases. (Changes) Casey's social life went
    through many changes and likely will for the rest of her life. Myself: I have the
    Moon in this house as well.
    12th house: Submerged behavior. Self-undoing. Prisons and institutions. Casey
    will probably NOT recidivate. She has nothing in her 12th house, so it is not a
    concern for her. Myself: I have Uranus in the 12th. Uranus governs computers.
    I only learned the computer at the age of 54. (Submerged behavior) I only
    understand the most rudimentry skills on the computer. I don't own a "smart
    phone" or any other gizmos. "Submerged." This technology will likely lead to my
    "undoing" because I know enough to antagonize people, but not enough to amend my messages.

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    1. why do all these magic people seem attracted to this site?

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  17. A comment unrelated to this post --

    I am not sure I understand why a sociopath would care to somewhat "demystify" the condition? Maybe that's not the point of this blog -- but I did watch the Dr. Phil thing -- and I guess I'm hazy in understanding what the point of non-sociopaths/empaths understanding a sociopath would be...to a sociopath? WHY do you care?

    I don't see how there would be any need or desire for others/society to understand you.

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    1. I can think of a few reasons a sociopath would go on TV with Dr. Phil:

      Super high self-regard aka overconfidence

      Fearlessness

      Boredom/thrill-seeking

      Dr. Phil wanted to talk about an issue that interested M.E.

      You only live once

      You might learn something

      You might make an impact (grandiose)

      I'm a socipath/psychopath. I like volunteering to be around sick/suffering people - mostly because it is interesting. I derive some pleasure from making others happy, but that's not a major drive for me.

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    2. That's about as it's going to get for us "paths." I haven't murdered anybody yet. Though last night after a friendly "discussion" with my wife of 49 years, we might have done each other in. We're on better terms today, but it's an open question whether we will die "naturally" or after plunging knives in each other's hearts. Vote for whom you want to stab first.

      RA posting as anon.

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    3. RA, Stab a stand-in chicken. Then roast it up and eat heartily. Really just about as satisfying and productive, or so I hear.

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    4. That's pretty funny, Faust. First, my wife has four hens that she loves dearly, as if they were little grandchildren (though we have a perfectly good grandchild with two mommies and two daddies). Second, all our chickens have been hatched at hatcheries, and my wife adopted them as baby chicks and tenderly raised them as babies from about the age of four (days). Today, she was musing about maybe raising some chicks from hatching.

      The problem is that hens lay eggs without a rooster, but not fertile eggs. Chickens sex is not tender or romantic. Basically, it's rape. So in my stupidity I said, "Perhaps the vet can artificially inseminate the egg in the chicken so she lays fertile eggs."

      The problem here is that while our hens are fairly well protected against their neighbors in the woods -- coyotes, raccoons, hawks, eagles, and owls -- baby chicks would wander out and get eaten in a flash. So my wife started musing about baby chick proofing our chicken yard, which of course would mean more work for me.

      Today, while at the gym doing my 30 minutes a day of cardio to keep my 71 year old bod alive, I felt some chest pain. Heart burn or heart attack (like the one that killed my dad when he was 43? I popped some antacid on the way home and burped. So I may live for anther day.

      Unless, of course, I die in my sleep tonight. Which will perturb my wife a bit, but she is fairly tough. On the other hand, if I don't post tomorrow; then you can wonder, "What happened to RA."

      Oh, right, I am posting this on a sociopath web site. The best place in the universe to make sure my passing will be mourned. Well, who gives a shit. I am an atheist and once I am gone, it will be like a bubble popping in the wind.

      Sweet dreams, everyone.

      Delete
    5. Yes, RA. I've been told on this site that I'm humorous.

      Burping in moderation (as Buddha would say) is all good. But, if the chest pains happen again, please see a doctor. We'd hate to lose you.

      Delete
    6. "AnonymousJanuary 28, 2015 at 12:56 PM

      I can think of a few reasons a sociopath would go on TV with Dr. Phil:

      Super high self-regard aka overconfidence

      Fearlessness

      Boredom/thrill-seeking

      Dr. Phil wanted to talk about an issue that interested M.E.

      You only live once

      You might learn something

      You might make an impact (grandiose)

      I'm a socipath/psychopath. I like volunteering to be around sick/suffering people - mostly because it is interesting. I derive some pleasure from making others happy, but that's not a major drive for me. "

      Okay -- those are reasons, but it still doesn't *really* answer the question I was getting at. And isn't the "super high self-regard" more so along the lines of narcissism anyway? That, I guess, is part of why I asked what I did. The appearance on the show to me, seemed to be of more narcissistic nature -- now, I'm not claiming to truly understand either (sociopath or narcissist) -- that's why I'm asking questions.

      All these labels/diagnoses frankly make me tired. What I'm more interested in is how those who identify themselves with a certain label/diagnosis see it -- why they identify themselves that way. "what you feel makes you-- you" is what interests me. Sometimes self-perception is not accurate, yet, I think it's by far the most relevant.

      And for the record, I can't stand Dr. Phil anyway.

      Delete
    7. Daughters of AnarchyJanuary 29, 2015 at 11:31 AM

      I don't like how Dr. Phil directed himself with M.E whatsoever... in his interview with her. His whole attitude and demeanor was like that he knew more than the doctor who originally diagnosed M.E. if I recall correctly, he was already geared up to misunderstanding her and thought sociopaths were most likely in the prison system. Ignorance. I think sociopathy is very misunderstood. There are three types of empathy that people possess depending on personality type. Sociopaths possess the traits of compassion empathy and cognitive empathy more than the "emotional|" empathy. Its not that they don't feel it, its shorter lived which has benefits as well.

      Delete
    8. Faust, I woke up this morning. You didn't lose me. I am pretty good about seeing my doctor, who tells me I am much more likely to have a stroke than a heart attack. Everybody dies. I would just as soon die in my sleep and not know I am dying, but that would be unpleasant for my wife. We had two fights this morning. I guess the moral is don't stay married for fifty years.

      After about 35 years of not teaching high school, I taught a high school class yesterday. As I taught for three yeares at one of the two most dangerous high schools in Seattle, I titillated the well behaved and (seemingly) attentive youngster with tales of how a gang member was arrested right out of my class by SPD and how about I had the opportunity to commit the perfect murder (against a very irritating but not dangerous 13-year-old kid). I also tittillated them by telling them that a young woman in one of my classes (at a much nicer school in Oregon) a couple years after graduation murdered her husband. She was sentenced to life in prison, but after 35 or 40 years or so was released. Then things got interesting.

      Delete
    9. How those that identify themselves see it - I suggest you read Fallon's or M.E.'s book. The typical reaction is something like, "no way!" (because it isn't "good" to be psychopath) followed by acceptance. Maybe later on you look back on it and realize that when you got diagnosed, and reflected say on one's fear deficit and callousness, one didn't feel any regret or remorse about having harmed others, nor any fear about the future damage one might inadvertently do to close friends/family, due to lacking the empathy, concern for the wellbeing of oneself and others and fear.

      A psychopath lacks insight - eg you know you're amoral and ruthless, but you don't put it together that this means others see you as "dangerous" or "evil". You might delude yourself into thinking you're "brave". You know you don't get upset about things and it causes problems, but you don't get upset about it or try to fix it.. or maybe you do, out of boredom - but not because you feel guilty about being "evil".

      Delete
    10. RA, I'll bet the kids in your class had a blast.

      So, what happened after the murdering wife was released from prison?

      Delete
  18. This is unrelated to the post but this came out yesterday:

    "Psychopaths' Brains Don't Grasp Punishment, Scans Rev"

    http://www.livescience.com/49613-psychopaths-brains-punishment.html

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Daughters of AnarchyJanuary 29, 2015 at 11:48 AM

      Interesting, thaxz for sharing it. :)

      Delete
    2. I saw this. I didn't see why it was novel - hasn't not learning from punishment been a known thing? Psychopaths are like cats when it comes to training: negative feedback fails. Positive feeback (for better or worse) works.

      Think about it - psychopaths regularly disgust people or shock them with their atypical responses and actions. The psychopaths don't tend to figure it out - explaining why they don't see the pissed off crowd with pitchforks and torches coming until it is too late.

      Delete
  19. Daughters of AnarchyJanuary 29, 2015 at 11:46 AM

    As a side note, here's my girl crush. lol. God she is hot.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YAo3Nefox2w

    ReplyDelete
  20. Dotter of Anarch, why do women always shave their armpits? My wife never shaved her armpits. When we were still sexually active, I thought she was hot enough. She has a vagina, she had a mouth, she had two hands. she had tits (though she was always freaked out because they were tiny, but really, what difference does that make?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Daughters of AnarchyJanuary 30, 2015 at 4:21 AM

      Love it RA. a man who accepts a women as they are. You cant get any better than that.

      Its a thing here to wax or shave it all off in Canada\America. don't know why we obsessed with it, lol.

      Delete
    2. I was a touch disappointed as I hear no mention of butt or legs. ~

      ~ means being sarcastic, y'all

      Delete
    3. RA, Who would have thought that beauty could be seen by the eye of a grump? Come on, admit it, you love her.

      Delete
    4. Daughters of AnarchyJanuary 30, 2015 at 11:22 AM

      Lol, ;)

      Delete
    5. Part of the rules to keep our tired relationship going is we never use the "L" word. If either of us said, "I love you" to the other, it would be code for "I want a divorce."

      Delete
  21. "There is no justification for the lack of positive human behavior." John Paul
    Sartre.
    It makes no difference whether you were abused or not. Right is right, and
    wrong is wrong. Many judges have a saying: "Ignorance of the law is no excuse."
    We have slowly duped ourselves with the notion that there is no evil, but only
    sickness. Were the people who killed the cartoonists in France, "sick," or were
    they "evil?" True enough, if a five year old gets a hold of a gun and starts shooting, he is not to be compared to an adult. And there are a FEW bonnie fide
    "crazy" people, but by and large people kill out of naracistic and greedy motives.
    The crowds in Paris that rallied after the slaughter, and said "People are REALLY good at heart," were just as niave as Ann Frank, who wrote that in her
    diary as she was taken to her death.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Cowardly anonymous 3:14 am. You are too wordy and I invite you to join my concise cult. (Ignore the fact that change one letter and cult becomes cunt.)

      Credo: Don't murder, torture, rape. Do help others, when feasible, sensible, practical, and fun. To join, send me $1 and I will send you a dozen business cards. Send me $500 and I will send me a shirt with the credo. I don't lie about living forever, which is total bullshit. In fact, I may die before I finish typyi

      Delete
  22. Here is a proud academician, another law school type (and from Yale, ouch for Yale), her self-adorned label is not socio or narc but 'tiger mom.' She is a divisive figure. As proud of her dog killing a squirrel as when her daughter giving a piano recital. What the f...! So curious how her daughters (19 and 22) will turn out.


    "Today, as Coco sat regal and sphinx-like among a pile of her stuffed animals, I saw one with a long, matted tail that didn’t look familiar. I looked more closely, then screamed for Jed. It was a squirrel that Coco must have lain in wait for, pounced on and thwacked to death. I’ve never been so proud, except maybe when Sophia gave her first piano recital."

    —Ms. Chua is a professor at Yale Law School, author of “Battle Hymn of the Tiger Mother” and co-author of “The Triple Package.”

    ReplyDelete
  23. Love the tweet, but let's be real. Men aren't wired to have empathy towards women. How else do you explain all the abuse towards women.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Some men are wired to have empathy toward women. They are called "transgender."

      Delete
    2. exactly....and I think it should be examined more from a scientific perspective on why it is men lack empathy towards women, and discussed out in the open.

      Delete
  24. The Bible says "Thou Shalt Not Kill." The real transulation is Thou shalt not
    murder." There is a difference between "murder," and killing. For the most part.
    you can't "murder" an animal. You only "kill" it for food, clothing, and religious
    rituals. Any "affectionate" feelings you develop towards the animal are emotional
    attachments that you form by "humanizing" the animal and treating it like a child.
    You only "murder" a fellow human being. But even in this case, there is a difference between "murder" and "killing." You have the right to self defense,
    which extends to "national defense" (War) Society has a right to self defense
    which means exceuting criminal convicted of capital crimes. The "crimes" might
    seem "small." A few hundred years ago horse theivery was a capital offense.
    Why? Because people could be stranded in isolated areas that could lead to thier own deaths if someone stole their horse.

    ReplyDelete
  25. What the fuck did you do with my horse? It's a very highly trained horse. I can communicate with it by telepathy. On my command, it will kick your head in. Will that qualify as murder? Hang the horse. See you at the supreme court, fool.

    ReplyDelete
  26. I don't know why there is a comments section. All it does is attracts a bunch of whiny cry baby borderline men who cut themselves, and ram themselves in to buildings because they're in tho muth pain waaaahhhhhh!!!!!!

    ReplyDelete
  27. Anonymous the coward # infinity minus 1 posting a 9:12 am. Please cut yourself. Please transmit the blood as an attachment so I can lick it off the library computer's screen. (They try to keep the library clean and safe, and your saliva may transmit STD's if someone carelessly touches it.) RA without his password because he is at the library and needing his blood sucking fit.

    ReplyDelete
  28. Why is society's answer always to lock them up? Lock up the schitzophrenics, the anxious, the depressed, the sociopaths....lock them up if they feel too much or not enough...lock them up because they're different.

    Sociopaths do not mean pyschopaths, though all pyscopaths are sociopaths. Not all sociopaths want to do acts that we consider despicable, though some will.

    But why is our answer to institutionalize and medicate those people? Who's going to pay for all of that?

    Sociopathy, as well as many other disorders, presents itself in childhood. The part of disorders that is always downplayed is that these people have strengths. That's right...they have a purpose and a place just as average, normal people do. A sociopath's strength is that they live without the emotions that hinder the rest of the world. They can be quite pleasant and successful if they apply themselves, and in this day and age; where being professional means separating yourself emotionally from all the people you deal with, they could make for incredible doctors, surgeons, pyschiatrists and so on.

    If we focussed on a way to identify people in childhood, and came up with more indivualized ways to teach these people - taught them how they learned instead of how we assume everyone should learn, then empaths, sociopaths, autistic, anxious, bipolar....the list is endless...people, could live very productive lives according to their talents (that we assume are weaknesses).

    When we take the different, lock them up, and medicate them because we're afraid of them, how does that make us any better than them? The problem doesn't lie in the fact that these people think and live differently than us. The problem comes from our failure to guide.

    -Red

    ReplyDelete
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