Wednesday, June 26, 2013

Fictional sociopaths: Iago

From Verdi's Otello:

I believe in a cruel God
who created me like himself
in anger of whom that I name.
From the cowardice of a seed
or of a vile atom I was born.
I am a son evil because I am a man;
and I feel the primitive mud in me.
Yes! This is my faith!
I believe with a firm heart,
so does the widow in the temple,
the evil I think
and proceeds from me,
fulfills my destiny.
I think the honest man
is a mockery,
in face and heart,
that everything is in him is a lie:
tears, kisses, looks,
sacrifices and honor.
And I think the man plays a game
of unjust fate
the seed of the cradle
the worm of the grave.
After all this foolishness comes death.
And then what? And then?
Death is Nothingness.
Heaven is an old wives' tale!


  1. I believe all that works for tragic drama....

    "It is the cause, it is the cause, my soul,
    Let me not name it to you, you chaste stars!
    It is the cause. Yet I'll not shed her blood;
    Nor scar that whiter skin of hers than snow,
    And smooth as monumental alabaster.
    Yet she must die, else she'll betray more men. "

    1. Yet she must die, else she'll betray more men. "

      yes, i am a true altruist crusader for all men

  2. Othello killed Desedomona by smothering her.

  3. Couldn't the person writing those words just be going through a depresive
    period? We take the way we feel in a given moment as a perminate reality
    when it is only a temparary phase. This is why it is so important to stay
    in the now. A lot of rash, unfortunate decisions can be made when people
    don't remain in the NOW.
    Biology is not destiny. I knew a person that came from an entire family of
    ner' do wells and suceeded. One simply must be aware that society wittingly
    or unwhitingly is engaged in a conspriacy to keep you ignorant and asleep.
    We take what we see as reality. Actually it is the contrived reality that
    the puppet masters want you to believe in.
    Why should I take anybody's word for anything? Why should I believe that
    old, dead methods are workable for everyone? We are our own wost enemies.
    The only question is wether we're consciously aware of it and can awaken
    or continue in comfortable delusional sleep.

    1. "We take the way we feel in a given moment as a perminate reality when it is only a temparary phase. This is why it is so important to stay in the now. A lot of rash, unfortunate decisions can be made when people don't remain in the NOW."

      If people remain in the NOW they will feel a given moment as a perminate reality when it is only a temparary phas, so this is why it is so important NOT to stay in the now.


    2. Trying to remain in the NOW is probably more beneficial for people with fear.

      People without fear prob don't need to practice in-the-now thinking as much; they need to stop and reflect imo.

    3. Well said, Monica

    4. thank you anon<3

  4. When you believe it is your destiny to be cruel, you have surrendered your will. In surrendering so absolutely to evil, you have lost all personal agency.

    On a lighter note: google "Sassy Gay Friend- Othello" to see an alternate end for the doomed Desdemona.

    1. You are doing better with your paranoia?

  5. This comment has been removed by the author.

  6. Replies
    1. long winded psychosis?

    2. I usually just skip over his posts, since they are redundant pieces of crap.

    3. Now I'm certain Misanthrope is Birdick.

    4. Wrong. He needs to pretend he’s smart and above it all to keep from facing that he’s a wannabe loser in reality. Me, I don’t give a fuck. I never come on here pretending to be anything other than what I am.

    5. I saw Birdick's post before it was removed, and while I can't speak for him, I suspect he removed his post after referencing Shakespeare and how the post was not typical given Shakespeare's usual brilliance at portraying different facets of what it means to be human through his work.

      Given the Verdi opera poster, it was unclear whether the libretto was based on Shakespeare's earlier play or was entirely unrelated- I had the same question in my mind- I'm guessing he didn't want to post something that wasn't relevant to the debate and simply self edited. (I could be wrong)

  7. @Mach
    I told you about Jessi a month ago but you had to be holier than thou. SW can help you face yourself. To me, you are very arrogant and that is what YOU have to face.

    1. We're all here to face our shadows... arrogance (esp intellectual) is certainly part of mine, but I am comforted that at least that puts me in good company here. ;)

      Whether or not you like me, Monica, I respect you, Monica(?- still not sure if this is you or someone pretending to be you). Whatever the case- I appreciate the dialogue.

      My issue with Jessi was her binary view of reality that made respectful debate impossible. Her tactics reminded me of a bully who believes she has God on her side. She won't miss me, though. My letting her know I no longer wanted to engage with her was to give her the heads up about why I didn't want to interact anymore. I never got that from you. Instead, I was impressed by your humility. Your life experience is one that likely has made you very wise and your insights are helpful to me as I try to hold up a lens through which to view the blind spots in my parenting.

    2. @ Mach It is me. I have been too lazy to set up another Google account.
      I don't care about Jessi but I am glad that you could face your intellectual arrogance. I come here to face myself as we are free to do so here and we get lots of help! :D

    3. I am not saying I don't like you, Mach. I just hate intellectual arrogance because it reminds me of my mother~

    4. For what it's worth, Monica- my "truth" is still very much evolving as I've recently experienced some rock your world life experiences. It's possible that I react to Jessi the way I do because I am reacting to a part of myself I'd very much like to move past.
      Re: intellectual arrogance- definitely see that it has been my primary means of defense against abusive individuals who were in various positions of power over me. When you are forced to submit to things you hate because you are young and female, it is quite satisfying to turn the tables by putting someone in their place with verbal jabs that cut deep. I've always had a good instinct for knowing exactly what to say to get a reaction- and when you are powerless, sometimes that is all you can do.
      My mother was brutal, very religious, self righteous, and a lazy thinker. It's no surprise that I developed this particular trait, but when I see it for what it currently is I can't play the role of victim and claim innocence here. A child fights back how ever they can, but an adult has the responsibility to consider the context of the interaction, which is something I can see that I have been a bit guilty of here. (transference is a bitch)
      For that reason, I see that I can't relate to Jessi in a positive manner so instead of ignore her, I'd rather just be straight with her about why I can't relate to her in a way that honors the golden rule- and then simply stop conversing her rather than continuing to let my verbal nastiness escalate.
      I hope you decide to set up another account and stick around on the forum (the real/fake Monica is confusing) because I think you are interesting. I liked your comments re: the wire monkey in particular.

      On another note- where is Andy?

    5. I have always honored the golden rule. You have accused me of things I have never done. I have never used any alias to attack you or anybody else, and I have nothing to do with the people that impersonated me. I grant you your wish of no interaction from this point.

    6. Thank you, Mach.

      I have a lot of experience with jerks. I used to react to everything. I would get in day long( heck week long) fights.

      I learned, through a really good mentor who took me under his wing, to ignore. That has been one of my most valuable lessons.

    7. I know I can't begin to understand the mind*** your mom put you through, but perhaps if you see that sometimes intellectual arrogance can be a defense mechanism rather than a strategy created just for the sake of being cruel, then what your mom did to you might hurt a little less. She obviously has her "stuff"- and you, as her daughter, likely got stuck dealing with the verbal aggressiveness she developed way before you entered the scene- so the pain inflicted was DEFINITELY not your fault. It sucks to be a kid. I know that parenting is the scariest thing I have ever done because I know how much pain being raised by a self absorbed mom caused me... so keep the reality check comments coming, please.

      Ignoring is hard until I relax into remembering- what the hell do I know?

    8. Thanks Mach.
      I am impressed that you could receive it. Truth is love. Anyone can BS someone. It takes courage to tell the truth <3

    9. telling the truth means that you still give a damn... and sometimes that's all we have to go on, even if we don't particularly like someone in the moment. Truth to me is about showing respect. Anyone can blow sunshine up your ass (and some people will do it even as they gut you). Telling someone what you actually think communicates that you think they can handle hearing it- in my mind that is showing respect.

      I also like that you didn't globally denounce me as evil, but told me HOW I was pissing you off in a very specific way. That's the sort of criticism that is constructive, IMO.

    10. @Mach
      Therapy failed me. Psychology failed me, so I had to find my own program of healing. It started with me coming on here like one of the flying monkeys from the Wizard of Oz.

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  8. Oh, how sweet it would be to be a man who knows his nature and revels in it! A life lived as a grand hunt, chasing deer and women to spill blood or cum upon the earth. What a rich life, to know one's own desires and to sate them, living a life of violence and lust.

  9. Hi I have a question . It is about my mother and me.

    She has no editing filter and has always caused people discomfort with embarrasssing questions, inappropriate remarks. critical suggestions, just making people feel bad all the time.

    I grew up very aware of the way she made people feel, and i have struggled to not be associated with her ways. I am always judging my sibling as shew has inherited offending other people. My sibling tells me i am obviously not liking her, because i go to criticize my sibling for HER inconsiderate behaviour.

    I do not like being so afraid to be offensive. ( in my head i hear my mother's meanness. i wish those thoughts/words would go away.)

    So I always am editing and afraid to say bad things outloud or interrupt, or hurt anybody's feelings. I am highly tuned in to when a person is hurt. I am the most sensitive person in my family towards the emotions of other people. I can see if someone is offended right away. (I could slice up someone's world view and self esteem very well if i wanted to and when i get angry i will think about doing so. I only do it once in a while)

    But I am stuck a little because i have too many thoughts going on in my head . I trying too hard to do right by myself at the same time not offend others. It is also a false self. I have narcissism, i know. but it is not like my mother's.

    What kind is it?

    1. the very fact you are as self aware as you are is a tremendously good sign.

    2. Thank u, mach. I aM a lways trying to find a way not to have to think about the way I present myself. To all people all day, even to a s.o. I am not young. We talk about masks here so I try to see what is real and ehat is not. For yhe most part my mask is sweet. I think this is fine. But I think I am not sweet inside, not at all. I find sweet mask, because there are so mamy sweet people in the world to relate to this way. My town is notorious for abrasive typed but really we are sweet trying to live in choas. My problem is that I dont think I need to be sweet. It is a draining habit. But I dont not want to be the sarcastic downer pessimistic bitch i have to fight each day all day in , my head either. After all these years, my mother and siblings voices still predominate my mind, so I feel tired and also end up somtimes not knoeing how in synch i am wiyh them. I do not want them in my head.they hurt me and my progress in with transforming into happier person about myself. Bottom line is that i really
      Ookong forward to lovong myselg so much some day that i dont even have to thonk about , yself any, ore. It os d do I esny to rejrct them. But am really rejecting a part of myself and I dont want to keep doing that .

    3. Maybe you don't need to be so hard on yourself.

      All of us have different facets to our personality. They are all true- but sometimes we have to dial back the intensity of what we may be feeling in a given moment for the sake of social convention. People talk about sociopaths having to wear a mask, but I think any self aware person shows different sides of their personality depending on the social context.

      For me there's my professional persona which is a hard driving, type A journalist. Then there's my mom persona- which ranges from tender to stern, depending on what the situation calls for. When I visit my parents I slip into dutiful daughter and have to bite my tongue the entire weekend unless I want to start a fight. With my boyfriend I am a relaxed free spirit. They are all me. Masks? Not really- but I do realize I behave differently with different people.

      My question for you is: Have you considered that you may need to make a life for yourself apart from your family? If it is hard to be sweet it is because you are not a good fit with your environment. I left home at 18 and never looked back. Despite a divorce at 32, I do not regret my early marriage or decision to begin a new life 700 miles away from my parents.

      The less you have to listen to your mom and siblings, the freer you will be.

      Figure out what makes you happy. Then find a way to spend more time with those people, and in those circumstances. I suspect your general mood will change. It's all about finding an environment where it is safe to be yourself. I know it may not be possible yet, but in the meantime- strive to understand yourself and what makes you happy. Then do your best to become financially and emotionally independent from your birth family so you don't have to keep faking sweetness. That would wear on anyone.

      In the meantime, be more gentle with yourself. It's very normal to hate everyone sometimes. Everyone feels that way, esp if they don't have much control of their environments because they have to get along with controlling individuals. You seem like a thoughtful individual who is in the process of transformation- many people never even bother to examine their behavior- the fact you do is admirable.

    4. thank you mach. you are kind.
      I am older than i may seem. I am on my own, have been divorced, no kids, but i have a life i have made.
      It is so/so.

      I weant to respond with some moe information but i am feeling very low tonight.

      You are right, i need to be more kind to myself. all i want to do is eat too much and hate myself and pinish myself for being alive today . it is a bad day.

      and guess what? just a few hrs agoi was telling myself i had almost everything i have ever wanted in a very very long time.
      i often think how much longer do i have to be in my head. I would like to have a sociopath twist my head around so much o dont recognize mydelf, but somehow i always do and i am always ugly.

    5. that was inappropriate, i am not feeling well tonight. sorry. i am fine.

    6. Sometimes, Life sucks. For me, too. Just part of the human condition thing. I am sorry you feel bad. It seems like you are very hard on yourself. Perhaps the overly harsh words of your mother follow you- I know this is something I still struggle with. The only thing that has helped me "hear" her less is to spend less time with her and more time with people I like better. Maybe this forum can become a place where you can feel freer being yourself. I hope so. Peace, my friend.

    7. thank you very much. You are so kind.

      why do you call yourself machavellian again? i know when you first came you said, but i don't recall. I wonder if it is because you have gotten much from your life by allowing the way you read people to benefit you almost (but not really)the way the sociopath does. I find that people (myself included --on a good day!)who are good at reading cues from others get social perks.

      Do you or anyone else here for that matter consider ^this^ thing i describe as machavellian?

      I am going to repost this on more recent post.

  10. Hello,
    I wonder what jobs are the most fitting for sociopaths and why? I tried to Google the answer but could only find the same scale of jobs that attract most psychopaths instead of ones where a sociopath would feel most comfortable.
    Thanks in advance,

  11. Sociopathy is such an ugly word, I prefer to be called "truly great".

    1. you aren't, you're just another moron trying to get by.

    2. Ha, even I don't think of sociopathy as "truly great" and I have a huge superiority complex.

    3. when my dad screamed at me and called me a psycho bitch, in my mind, i heard "you are awesome".

    4. hahaha, I must admit that's a good way of translating things like that even if I don't share your views.

  12. It was a positive conversation and each day since then he has made an effort to come and speak to her about his success of the day. |

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  14. I remember reading this play in class and the "sociopath alarm" wailing in my head because of everything I have read on this blog. I explained it, not many people believed me.


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