tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-628748600098131100.post576240325148054721..comments2024-03-28T00:33:57.308-07:00Comments on Sociopath World: The Rationality of ToleranceUnknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger102125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-628748600098131100.post-46413664195612095102017-03-29T12:29:34.015-07:002017-03-29T12:29:34.015-07:00Opening up - admitting I cared - is really what ch...Opening up - admitting I cared - is really what changed me. I admitted my own personhood.<br /><br />Caring creates a kind of vulnerability and their foremost orientation is to avoid vulnerability. **-* is progressively opening up, but this entails me reducing the risk for him first. It's not a smooth process because I obviously don't want to be hurt either. <br /><br />It's a matter of choosing to recognise every positive thing he does, even if it's not quite what I hoped for or expected. And also recognising that manipulations are still attempts at communication. <br /><br />And of course being open about my feelings, listening to him and apologising for where I have impacted him as well. Supernocturnal explained - I think - very accurately how they give us an experience to match their own when crushed. <br /><br /><br /><br />It's communication in the most risk-free way possible. That's how to view it*.<br /><br />Maybe I'm strange but that process does seem to create a new beginning each time. A fresh start, only a little bit deeper every time. We know each other better, things make more sense.<br /><br /><a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TDhLXkRhg60" rel="nofollow">Neo: You could have just asked.<br />Seraph: No. You do not truly know someone until you fight them.</a><br /><br />With someone who is very private and gives out very little information about their position, sometimes the puzzle pieces don't fit together even when they are telling the truth. These episodes provide more information about position, stance, and level of investment.<br /><br />Why is it worth it for us? I don't know. He doesn't know either. But it is.<br /><br />*Both he and I are like my little sons getting so angry because they are afraid to express themselves clearly. My sons are learning, they're both growing a lot by opening up as you say, anon. I am really trying to set that example. Hopefully **-* and I can reach a smoother mechanism of communication. I think it will come with trust. Trust is building but very, very slowly, as one would expect in the circumstance.Northhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09244806273774124428noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-628748600098131100.post-19112021054689297682017-03-29T11:44:31.190-07:002017-03-29T11:44:31.190-07:00What a fabulous pile...What a fabulous pile...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-628748600098131100.post-61381462447500304582017-03-29T04:22:27.965-07:002017-03-29T04:22:27.965-07:00"As soon as we can give a reason for a feelin..."As soon as we can give a reason for a feeling, we are no longer under the spell of it."<br /><br />This is true, M.E., and it explains so much - giving reason to our cascading thoughts and behaviors. <br /><br />My father died several years ago. I was not able to bring myself to go to his funeral, since it would have crushed me. Above all, I loved him too. It took me this long and this much to mourn his death. I have done it in other places as well, but I would like to especially thank you for this free platform of expression that is your site, friend, together with your insights. <br /><br />Moral: Go to your father's funeral, reader! If not, there will be far-reaching, extended repercussions. I know it quite well. Metaphorically speaking, you will be calling him for years - as the above song by Jeff Buckley says. <br /><br />I was thinking of him through these expressive words yesterday. “You - you alone will have the stars as no one else has them...In one of the stars I shall be living. In one of them I shall be laughing. And so it will be as if all the stars were laughing, when you look at the sky at night...You - only you - will have stars that can laugh.”<br /><br />So, today, I stopped calling him, and I am at peace with it. <br /><br />In memoriam:<br /><br />https://i.ytimg.com/vi/niDscAFzH54/maxresdefault.jpg<br /><br />https://assets.mubi.com/images/film/11922/image-w856.jpg?1445897017<br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-628748600098131100.post-35995209013143664032017-03-28T07:47:34.965-07:002017-03-28T07:47:34.965-07:00"It's been a while since I've played ..."It's been a while since I've played this song." https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EJk3RErKtmI<br /><br />"Every time I find the meaning of life they change it." http://images.fandango.com/imagerelay/500/0/video.fandango.com/MPX/image/NBCU_Fandango/665/451/002230_1920x1080_536131139633.jpg/image.jpg/redesign/static/img/noxSquare.jpg (It would have been great to be able to embed this image.)<br /><br />“You - you alone will have the stars as no one else has them...In one of the stars I shall be living. In one of them I shall be laughing. And so it will be as if all the stars were laughing, when you look at the sky at night...You - only you - will have stars that can laugh.” Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-628748600098131100.post-70292196905120703172017-03-28T07:31:50.118-07:002017-03-28T07:31:50.118-07:00"I have written this letter to you on a happy..."I have written this letter to you on a happy day to me, which is also the last day of my life. For I have been attacked by a painful inability to urinate, and also dysentery, so violent that nothing can be added to the violence of my sufferings. But the cheerfulness of my mind, which comes from the recollection of all my philosophical contemplation, counterbalances all these afflictions. And I beg you to take care of the children of Metrodorus, in a manner worthy of the devotion shown by the young man to me, and to philosophy." A Signature - http://www.signature-reads.com/2014/11/epicurus-camus-a-little-hedonism-and-one-gratifying-day/<br /><br />https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qQ0kOi6qqHY - "A Scratch, a scratch" - https://i.ytimg.com/vi/IFwb0bo0faw/maxresdefault.jpgAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-628748600098131100.post-60737434108679813742017-03-28T05:01:06.815-07:002017-03-28T05:01:06.815-07:00Weird i can't post under my wordpress accountWeird i can't post under my wordpress accountAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07061773768901553530noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-628748600098131100.post-32197104016202203382017-03-28T05:00:33.967-07:002017-03-28T05:00:33.967-07:00https://sociopathphilosophy.wordpress.comhttps://sociopathphilosophy.wordpress.comAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07061773768901553530noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-628748600098131100.post-41212992880530169502017-03-28T04:51:53.253-07:002017-03-28T04:51:53.253-07:00Jesus fxking christ so many comments i can find th...Jesus fxking christ so many comments i can find the ones to meAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07061773768901553530noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-628748600098131100.post-85025338006206005932017-03-27T10:39:27.806-07:002017-03-27T10:39:27.806-07:00We all can access that reptilian reflex-maybe that...We all can access that reptilian reflex-maybe that's why i feel like a snake striking. But there is no need to stay stuck there. Opening up does seem to be a huge part of it. The sociopath I knew insisted that they didn't care about anyone. This was much later of course but I feel this was their true *belief* and I've heard other sociopaths insist the same thing. They don't care about anyone or anything. It feels completely unnatural to me. Opening up-just admitting you care-opens new world inside yourself. anonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06171208907687415100noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-628748600098131100.post-17231555087110351182017-03-27T09:59:46.018-07:002017-03-27T09:59:46.018-07:00"It's a sad dynamic, isn't it. They n..."It's a sad dynamic, isn't it. They needn't be struck at if they opened up a fraction."<br /><br />https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vKuyGOhVfcs<br /><br />https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MUKqG4KEKcY<br /><br />.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-628748600098131100.post-6332045412406802472017-03-27T09:49:51.725-07:002017-03-27T09:49:51.725-07:00"It is robotic. Its like now that they have b..."It is robotic. Its like now that they have been away from me(the sociopath) they have no idea how to be....I can't help but almost being in shock at it. How would they ever think they could attract me with what they do. Its very hard to accept this is what they are. I think maybe i have seen a much uglier side than you perhaps.<br /><br />And I am also aware of the way I respond. I have said before I strike like a snake."<br /><br />Did someone arrive to bring a message?<br />https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VMaGjYuFHXE<br /><br />"North I don't mean to imply anything with that last sentence."<br /><br />**<br /><br />"My ex-husband is far more dangerous than **-*, that's true. I saw him yesterday with his coterie of hangers-on. It astounds me how he can choreograph their behaviour for years on end, male and female.<br /><br />**-* has his peculiarities and particulars. His talent is coming up with a set of almost-lies that he can use but back out of when called on. It's just distance with him."<br /><br />.<br /><br />"Also, I think intimacy for **-* is a very physical thing. He often says that's how he communicates with me, that's what he understands rather than talking. And this rings very true of my experience with him; his body tells me everything. And it's how he reached me, that lost part of me."<br /><br />.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-628748600098131100.post-17363218016229750992017-03-26T10:48:52.806-07:002017-03-26T10:48:52.806-07:00Also, I think intimacy for **-* is a very physical...Also, I think intimacy for **-* is a very physical thing. He often says that's how he communicates with me, that's what he understands rather than talking. And this rings very true of my experience with him; his body tells me everything. And it's how he reached me, that lost part of me. It's hard to remember, though, to trust his body.Northhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09244806273774124428noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-628748600098131100.post-38665242441060467242017-03-26T10:39:56.679-07:002017-03-26T10:39:56.679-07:00It's a sad dynamic, isn't it. They needn&#...It's a sad dynamic, isn't it. They needn't be struck at if they opened up a fraction. A vicious circle, I imagine, throughout their lives - they expect and pre-empt threat that would be easily avoidable with the simplest of measures.<br /><br />They are such solitary, self-contained creatures.Northhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09244806273774124428noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-628748600098131100.post-58896814855053285592017-03-26T10:11:49.282-07:002017-03-26T10:11:49.282-07:00anon, I think dreams can be part of the sensemakin...anon, I think dreams can be part of the sensemaking process. Maybe it's easier to process the very confusing elements subconsciously, visually. <br /><br />My ex-husband is far more dangerous than **-*, that's true. I saw him yesterday with his coterie of hangers-on. It astounds me how he can choreograph their behaviour for years on end, male and female. <br /><br />**-* has his peculiarities and particulars. His talent is coming up with a set of almost-lies that he can use but back out of when called on. It's just distance with him. And he doesn't see my needs until they directly impact him, ie when I lose my temper. <br /><br />I was drinking with my boss when **-* cancelled on me at the last minute. I roughly outlined this story for him and he agrees that **-* is a step up from my ex-h but things should be easier. He painted a nice picture of "easier" as being quite achievable. I think I probably still have some work to do on myself. I need to be around stable, secure people and learn to create a secure self image first. Northhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09244806273774124428noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-628748600098131100.post-22797284028308739962017-03-26T05:05:29.831-07:002017-03-26T05:05:29.831-07:00North this makes so much sense. I think we experi...North this makes so much sense. I think we experience the complete lack of regard that is so foreign, so utterly *blah* as though someone is actively trying to obliterate Us. And I am also aware of the way I respond. I have said before I strike like a snake. It is something I am usually not even aware of until afterwards. It is a reflex. anonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06171208907687415100noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-628748600098131100.post-88410173160926953522017-03-26T04:26:04.439-07:002017-03-26T04:26:04.439-07:00North I also didn't mean to post just one sent...North I also didn't mean to post just one sentence. From what you have described your X husband seems more like the sociopath I knew. I'm certain you have seen your share of ugly sides. *_** seems different. I have experienced different too and I have to believe they truly *are* different. anonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06171208907687415100noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-628748600098131100.post-81200121108053171682017-03-26T04:02:53.407-07:002017-03-26T04:02:53.407-07:00North I don't mean to imply anything with that...North I don't mean to imply anything with that last sentence.anonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06171208907687415100noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-628748600098131100.post-91518596183823361032017-03-26T03:46:28.705-07:002017-03-26T03:46:28.705-07:00North it's so strange you mentioned that movie...North it's so strange you mentioned that movie. I have felt a strange pull lately to watch it again. I identify with that character in so many ways, especially the last few months or so. Its been a long time since I saw it but what I remember was her unlikely vulnerability and loyalty. I wonder why these things have happened to me. When I wake up in the middle of the night with dreams that don't even seem possible to have been mine. It is robotic. Its like now that they have been away from me(the sociopath) they have no idea how to be....I can't help but almost being in shock at it. How would they ever think they could attract me with what they do. Its very hard to accept this is what they are. I think maybe i have seen a much uglier side than you perhaps. anonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06171208907687415100noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-628748600098131100.post-51706350153068735562017-03-26T00:58:26.272-07:002017-03-26T00:58:26.272-07:00"Indeed, the fox. That's exactly it. I ch..."Indeed, the fox. That's exactly it. I changed the environment and he contacted me."<br /><br />He did so, since there must have been something he had not seen before. That is how these discoveries occur. <br /><br />Also stranger than fiction http://www.comingsoon.net/movies/news/557093-watch-trent-reznors-score-plays-razor-blade-posters-girl-dragon-tattoo?<br /><br />"And I don't know that **-* would claim it. He is very values-based, which astounds and humbles me. I feel like a machine talking to him sometimes.<br /><br />Maybe it starts with having our own needs met, our selves reflected back to us fairly and constructively."<br /><br />How do you feel about the exquisite art of packaging? <br />http://cr8id.com/the-girl-with-the-dragon-tattoo/<br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-628748600098131100.post-82385910517182618552017-03-25T18:26:44.586-07:002017-03-25T18:26:44.586-07:00Anon 5:32: Indeed, the fox. That's exactly it....Anon 5:32: Indeed, the fox. That's exactly it. I changed the environment and he contacted me.<br /><br />Anon: 5:49. I enjoyed that clip - what's the movie? <br /><br />anon: Thanks :)<br />Did you ever see The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo? I feel I'm not unlike her; there's a part of me that wishes I could put that amount of distance between myself and others. But I know that would be a lie and so I have to be brave and keep moving forward, growing into my own nature. I think you are right: our nature is to care for ourselves and others.Northhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09244806273774124428noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-628748600098131100.post-87380301945019464882017-03-25T18:23:15.027-07:002017-03-25T18:23:15.027-07:00Hi A,
"Upon what do we base the preferences ...Hi A,<br /><br /><em>"Upon what do we base the preferences which undergird the narratives we create? Logic and rationality, or an appeal to emotion, as manufactured and shaped by the influences which surround us, intimately and societally? <br /><br />I would posit that most empaths appeal to emotion above reason, be it to prop up our compassion, a desire for altruism, or on account of virtue signalling within our respective tribal echo chambers. This clouds objectvitity."</em><br /><br />"Virtue signalling within our respective tribal echo chambers." Excellent! I'm sure I will poach this :p<br /><br />I don't think anyone acts for these reasons. Really, no. There <em>is</em> a potent element of normalisation as you suggest, but I don't think anyone acts <em>for the sake of emotion or compassion or altruism</em>. Emotion is a shortcut driving behaviours that have been selected for. Reciprocal altruism is selected for in all social species, to varying degrees. People do have conscious drives, however, to act in ways that are approved of by others. Naturally. But that's normalisation. Sociopaths achieve normalisation by different mechanisms - I don't think there's a wrong or right way. And don't forget that cheating and ability to recognise cheating are also selected for. We all do both to varying degrees.<br /><br />Also consider that some "altruism" is really patterned "enabling" or a means to dominate or raise profile or any number of other less-than-well-intentioned actions. <br /><br />I think people with secure attachment have a good, healthy balance between self and others - see the Venn diagram I linked to below. There's nothing over the top or sickening in their altruism; it comes from a centred core and expects a fair response. <br /><br /><em>I do not claim to be objective, but the means through which I have arrived at my worldview was systematic, and based upon a great deal of research, and skeptical inquiry.</em><br />I don't doubt this. But I would naturally say the same for myself!! I don't imagine you'd find any Myers Briggs NT type that would say differently. And I don't know that **-* would claim it. He is very values-based, which astounds and humbles me. I feel like a machine talking to him sometimes. <br /><br /><em>My faith, with its accompanying teleology and sotriology, is more robust, yet flexible- due to my intellectual pliability and fluid sense of self- than anything I might envisage without an external construct to which to appeal.</em><br />You often seem humbled by your religion; maybe it's a grounding influence? I have met someone IRL who reminds me of you, but is perhaps less grounded. She's probably too much for me.Northhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09244806273774124428noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-628748600098131100.post-52335282663496476602017-03-25T17:58:04.482-07:002017-03-25T17:58:04.482-07:00On empathy
Venn diagrams of the different relatio...<strong>On empathy</strong><br /><br />Venn diagrams of the different relationships between self and others:<br /><br /><a href="https://intjforum.com/applications/core/interface/imageproxy/imageproxy.php?img=https://unpickled.files.wordpress.com/2016/01/apathy.png&key=1ddc10ebc87553da42ef166e77f3e62d037ee973067a31f4177bb606c440c8d1" rel="nofollow">Apathy | Narcissism | Codependence | Empathy (EQ)</a><br /><br />In this model, empathy is defined as connection and understanding. The self does not obliterate others; neither is the self obliterated by others.<br /><br />My son's counsellor described empathy as being aware of how your actions impact others. <br /><br />I think these are both very practical ways of understanding empathy; these are things I am only now aware of. <br /><br />PB's comment above about people judging themselves in comparison with others: this has helped me understand my mother's behaviour. She preferred me to be helpless as a child because it allowed her to feel less helpless. So she never comforted me. <br /><br />I think not having a clear reflection of my self as a child has made it difficult for me to know myself but also to reflect and understand others. When I get really frightened, I act impulsively and with no regard to others. i.e. I act without empathy. And it doesn't work. (This week was a particularly special case that I've learnt a lot from. And believe me I got both barrels back. But we've more or less apologised to each other now.)<br /><br />I think this is similar to not being able to recognise another person's needs more generally speaking. At least I can extend my own experience of lacking empathy to comprehend why maybe he just can't see my needs, even when I tell him. I can kinda understand what that place looks like: it's a place filled with one's own needs. I mean, filled. And I think that can be a place that doesn't necessarily mean harm to another. <br /><br />So what I'm saying is that empathy - as is often remarked upon here - isn't some magical quality. Maybe it is a capability that allows for longer-term reciprocation as a social strategy. Maybe it starts with knowing ourselves as social creatures in relationship with others. Maybe it starts with having our own needs met, our selves reflected back to us fairly and constructively. Northhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09244806273774124428noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-628748600098131100.post-57848958282995145792017-03-24T06:13:51.539-07:002017-03-24T06:13:51.539-07:00too latinatetoo latinatebitter and crankynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-628748600098131100.post-76983612827337449282017-03-24T06:12:59.843-07:002017-03-24T06:12:59.843-07:00North thank you for your bravery. Its very rare a...North thank you for your bravery. Its very rare and refreshing. I think your right about opening up to others about your experience. Allowing yourself to care is maybe the most important thing you can do. Everything with sociopaths seem to trace back to that point. Someone stopped caring and everything snowballed from there. The lies that one must tell themself to deny their own nature are neverending. We all are meant to care for ourselves and for others. anonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06171208907687415100noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-628748600098131100.post-71878916677335224202017-03-24T05:49:23.183-07:002017-03-24T05:49:23.183-07:00Anon: "I am not broken or ruined. Those are a...Anon: "I am not broken or ruined. Those are all lies. Glitches. I hold onto my truths. They were always mine. I only wanted to share them with someone who had already written the end of the story. But I am infinite. There is no end of the story."<br /><br />North: "And yes, I will date others and find someone more compatible."<br /><br />https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y6__a9PjNX4<br /><br />Be happy. All's well that ends well. :)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com